Feb 08, 2023 Planning Commission

TO THE EAST OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY AND THE, UM, PROPERTIES TO THE NORTH.

GOOD EVENING, MR. CHAIR.

PLANNING COMMISSIONERS.

GOOD EVENING.

GOOD EVENING, SIR.

UH, MR. GURLEY'S GONNA PUT UP OUR, UM, I JUST HAVE A COUPLE SLIDES, UH, THAT ARE, UH, MIRROR WHAT YOU HAVE IN YOUR PACKET AS FAR AS THE PROPERTY LOCATION MAP.

AND THEN WE ALSO HAVE THE CONCEPTUAL SITE PLAN, UH, THAT THE APPLICANT HAS PROPOSED FOR THE SITE.

OF COURSE, THAT'S, UH, JUST THE CONCEPT PLAN, UH, FOR STAFF AS WELL AS THE LAND DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE TO LOOK AT AND, AND COMMENT ON.

IT'S CERTAINLY, UH, SUBJECT, SUBJECT TO CHANGE.

UH, WE DID BASE SOME OF OUR CONDITIONS ON THAT SITE PLAN AS WELL, BUT, UH, AGAIN, THE APPLICANTS ARE HERE THIS EVENING, UM, AND THEY'RE SEEKING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, UH, FOR SELF SERVICE STORAGE FACILITY.

UH, ON THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, AGAIN, THE PROPERTY'S APPROXIMATELY 3.93 ACRES, UH, JUST SHY OF, UH, FOUR ACRES.

THE PROPERTY'S LOCATED, UM, JUST OFF THE, UH, NORTHBOUND ON RAMP ON I 85.

UM, OFF OF, UH, WHAT IS THE FRONTAGE ROAD, UH, THAT'S NAMED BUCKSKIN DRIVE.

UH, YOU CAN SEE THAT ON YOUR SLIDE, UH, THAT YOU HAVE ON, ON YOUR MONITORS AS WELL AS, UH, THE PUBLIC MONITORS THIS EVENING.

UH, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UH, IS ZONED B TWO BUSINESS GENERAL.

THE PROPERTIES TO THE NORTH ARE ALSO, UM, ZONED B TWO BUSINESS GENERAL PROPERTIES

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UM, THOSE LARGE PARCELS ARE ZONED A TWO AGRICULTURAL GENERAL.

AND THEN WE DO HAVE THE PARCEL THAT IS JUST SOUTH OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UH, THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS EVENING.

UM, THAT WAS REZONED FROM B TWO BUSINESS GENERAL, UH, TO A TWO AGRICULTURAL GENERAL BACK IN JUNE OF 2019.

UH, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UH, LOOKING AT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IS IN WITHIN, WITHIN THE RURAL CONSERVATION PLANNING AREA, UH, AS DEFINED AGAIN WITHIN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, UH, WHEN I 85 WAS CONSTRUCTED THROUGH THE COUNTY, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY AS WELL AS THE PROPERTY ADJACENT TO THE I 85 INTERCHANGE, AGAIN, WAS ORIGINALLY ZONED B TWO BY THE COUNTY, UH, TO HOPEFULLY ALLOW FOR, UH, BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT AROUND THE I 85 AND ROUTE 40 INTERCHANGE.

UH, AGAIN, WHEN WE TOOK THE APPLICATION, UH, REQUEST, UH, FOR THE SELF-SERVICE STORAGE, UH, FACILITY TO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE, UH, THERE WAS, UH, LITTLE DISCUSSION, UM, GIVEN THAT, UH, THERE'S NO PUBLIC UTILITIES, UH, ON THAT, UM, SIDE OF THE INTERSTATE ON THE EAST SIDE OF INTERSTATE 85 AND A ALONG ROUTE 40 THERE.

UM, THE ONLY PUBLIC UTILITIES ARE WITHIN THE TOWN OF MCKINNEY, AND OF COURSE THOSE DON'T EXTEND ACROSS, UH, THE I 85, UH, INTERCHANGE THERE.

UM, TRANSPORTATION IMPACTS, UH, VDOT DID LOOK AT THE CONCEPT PLAN AS WELL AS, UH, LOOKED AT THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.

UM, VDOT HAD THE FOLLOWING, UH, PRELIMINARY REVIEW COMMENTS.

UH, ONE, THE PROPOSED USE WILL REQUIRE THE CONSTRUCTION OF COMMERCIAL ENTRANCES, UM, AT THE SITE THAT MEET VDOT STANDARDS AND SPECIFICATIONS TO THE SCHEMATIC PLAN.

SUBMITTED FOR REVIEW SHOWS TWO PROPOSED COMMERCIAL ENTRANCES, AND VDOT HAS NO OBJECTION TO THE TWO PROPOSED ENTRANCES INCLUDED ON THE SCHEMATIC LAYOUT PLAN.

AND THREE, BASED ON THE ITE TRIP GENERATION MANUAL 10TH EDITION, THE PROPOSED WILL GENERATE APPROXIMATELY 150 AVERAGE ANNUAL DAILY TRIPS.

AND THIS INCREASE IN TRAFFIC IS NOT EXPECTED TO HAVE ANY IMPACTS ON, UM, F 80.

THAT'S THE FRONTAGE ROAD, OR BETTER KNOWN AS BUCKSKIN DRIVE.

UM, STAFF THIS EVENING IS RECOMMENDING, UH, APPROVAL OF THE REQUEST FOR THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, UH, SUBJECT TO THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.

UH, ONE THAT THE STORAGE BUILDINGS AND INDIVIDUAL STORAGE UNITS LOCATED ALONG THE FRONT OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY THAT ARE VISIBLE FROM THE I 85 RIGHT OF WAY SHALL BE CONSTRUCTED WITH A BRICK FRONT WITH EVES FOR THE PORTION OF THE BUILDING AND UNITS VISIBLE FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.

THE SELF-SERVICE STORAGE FACILITY SHALL HAVE NO MORE THAN 43,560 SQUARE FEET OF ENCLOSED STORAGE.

UM, THE PARKING AREA AND ALL AREAS BETWEEN THE STORAGE BUILDINGS SHALL BE PAVED AS EACH STORAGE BUILDING IS CONSTRUCTED.

SECURITY AND SITE LIGHTING INSTALLED SHALL BE DIRECTED INWARD AND DOWNWARD TO THE SITE AND SHALL NOT DIRECTLY CAST ONTO THE ADJACENT PROPERTIES.

IN ADDITION, EXTERIOR LIGHTING SHALL BE DARK SKY COMPLIANT AND SHALL NOT EXCEED A HALF OF FOOT FOOT CANDLE AT THE PROPERTY.

LINE FIVE, THE PORTION OF PROPERTY HOUSING.

THE SELF-SERVICE STORAGE FACILITY SHALL HAVE A SIX FOOT HIGH CHAIN LINK FENCE AROUND ITS PERIMETER, AND THE FENCING FOR RUNNING ON ROUTE F 80 RIGHT AWAY SHALL BE BLACK OR GREEN.

HEAVY VINYL COATED CHAIN LINK FENCING OR FENCING CONSTRUCTED OF WOOD, VINYL, ALUMINUM, OR WR IRON SIX.

THE APPLICANT WILL MAINTAIN THE ORDINANCE REQUIRED TWO PARKING SPACES, UM, THAT'S REQUIRED, UM, UH, FOR ANY POTENTIAL OFFICE EMPLOYEE PARKING SPACES AND ONE HANDICAP ACCESSIBLE SPACE ON THE SITE.

SEVEN, THE COMMERCIAL ENTRANCES TO THE BUSINESS SHALL BE AT THE VDOT APPROVED LOCATION.

THE APPLICANT SHALL MAINTAIN A VDOT COMMERCIAL ENTRANCE PERMIT, AND THE COMMERCIAL ENTRANCE SHALL MEET VDOT DESIGN AND

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CONSTRUCTION STANDARDS EIGHT.

AS PART OF THIS MINI STORAGE FACILITY, THERE SHALL BE NO MORE THAN FIVE INOPERATIVE VEHICLES STORED OUTSIDE ON THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, AND ANY INOPERATIVE VEHICLES SHALL BE STORED IN THE REAR OF THE FACILITY AND SCREENED FROM PUBLIC VIEW.

THE HOURS OF OPERATION FOR THE SELF-SERVICE STORAGE FACIL FACILITY SHALL BE LIMITED TO MONDAY THROUGH SUNDAY FROM 7:00 AM TO 8:00 PM 10.

THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT SHALL BE REVIEWED A MINIMUM OF EVERY TWO YEARS FOR COMPLIANCE WITH THE STATED CONDITIONS.

AND 11, THE APPLICANT SHALL REMAIN IN COMPLIANCE WITH ALL FEDERAL, STATE, AND COUNTY RULES AND REGULATIONS.

AGAIN, STAFF IS, UH, RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OR REQUEST WITH THE SUBJECT CONDITIONS.

I ALSO WANTED TO, UH, JUST, UH, THE CONDITIONS THAT WE PROPOSED THIS EVENING.

UM, THESE ARE CONDITIONS THAT WE'VE USED ON OTHER RECENT, UH, CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS THAT WERE APPROVED FROM FOR OTHER MINI STORAGE FACILITIES.

UH, THE TWO MAIN ONES, UM, THAT WE LOOKED AT WERE IN THE COURTHOUSE AREA HERE.

UM, THE FACILITY, UH, THAT'S ON THE KARN PROPERTY WHERE THE BOTTOMS UP TANNING IS, UH, THOSE, UH, MINI STORAGE FACILITY.

UH, WE HAD VERY SIMILAR CONDITIONS AND WE ALSO APPROVED ONE ON THE, UH, AUGBURN PROPERTY THAT'S BEHIND THE CAR WASH IN THE COURTHOUSE AREA.

AND AGAIN, WE USED VERY SIMILAR, UH, CONDITIONS FOR, UM, THOSE FACILITY, THAT FACILITY AS WELL.

UM, SO I JUST WANTED TO, UH, GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF WHERE WE CAME UP WITH THESE CONDITIONS.

AND, UM, AGAIN, THESE ARE, UH, VERY SIMILAR, UH, TO THOSE CASES, UH, THAT WERE REVIEWED, UM, BACK IN 2012.

ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS THE STAFF AT THIS TIME OR, YEAH, I CAN YOU, UH, CLARIFY TO ME WHAT THOSE, UH, THREE RECTANGLE ARE ON THIS DRAWING TO THE LEFT ARE THE ONES THAT LOOK LIKE HE MAY BE STORAGE FACILITIES.

HE GOT 185 FOOT LONG BY, UM, I'M GONNA HAVE TO ASK THE APPLICANT TO ADDRESS THAT.

UM, OKAY.

NOT SURE HOW, AGAIN, THAT'S, IT'S JUST A CONCEPT PLAN THAT, THAT THEY WERE USING TO INTRODUCE THE PROJECT TO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE.

UM, MAY NOT, OBVIOUSLY IT WOULDN'T, UH, ESPECIALLY IF WITH THESE CONDITIONS AS AND OTHER ORDINANCE REQUIREMENTS, UM, THE PLAN WOULD HAVE TO, UM, I'M SURE BE ALTERED.

I KNOW THERE, UM, IF YOU LOOK AT THE CONTOURS, IT LOOKS LIKE THE DRAINAGE, UH, FOR THE PROPERTY, UM, GOES FROM THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY TO THE FRONT BUCKSKIN DRIVE.

SO IN TALKING WITH, UM, HIS ENGINEER PROBABLY HAVE TO HAVE SOME SORT OF STORM WATER MANAGEMENT ACTUALLY AT THE FRONT OF THE PROPERTY ALONG BUCK SKIN DRIVE VERSUS THE REAR.

UM, SO THAT'LL PROBABLY THE, UH, MANY STORAGE UNITS WOULD PROBABLY BE MOVED BACK INTO THE PROPERTY A LITTLE FURTHER, UM, THAT TYPE OF THING.

SO AGAIN, UH, THE APPLICANT WOULD HAVE TO ADDRESS THAT QUESTION FOR YOU, MR. CUNNINGHAM, THE APPLICANT IS HERE, SO WE CAN YES.

UM, HEAVY EAVES AND, UM, BRICK, UM, FRONTING ON THOSE, UM, THAT YOU'D SEE FROM PUBLIC VIEW, AGAIN, FROM BUCKSKIN DRIVE.

A'S HERE.

DO ANY OTHER BURNING QUESTIONS OR DO WE WANT TO GO TO THE, UH, I'D LIKE TO ASK A QUESTION.

WHY HAVE WE NOT DECIDED TO BE A LITTLE MORE STRINGENT ON SOME OF THESE THINGS? LIKE SOME OF THE, UH, STORAGE FACILITIES I'VE SEEN WITHIN CHESTERFIELD AND ALL WITH THE SOLID, UH, MASONRY WALLS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, SINCE THEY'RE IN HIGHER TRAFFIC AREAS.

AND I SEE THIS AS A VERY UNMOLESTED AREA SO FAR AND COULD BE A MAJOR, UH, PLACE TO START BUILDING HOUSES AND THINGS LIKE THAT BECAUSE IT'S NOT THAT FAR FROM COLONIAL HEIGHTS AND AREAS.

IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S A PLACE THAT DEVELOPMENT COULD HAPPEN.

WHY? MAYBE WE ARE NOT LOOKING AT MAYBE SETTING FORTH SOME BETTER STANDARDS FOR MANY STORAGE.

JUST A THOUGHT.

I MEAN, I, IS THERE NO REASON FOR THAT? I MEAN, ARE WE NOT WANT THINGS TO LOOK BETTER AGAIN? UM, AT LEAST AS, AS WE'VE INDICATED IN THE CONDITIONS FROM BUCKSKIN DRIVE AND FROM THE ON RAMP ON I 85, WE HAVE INDICATED, UM, THAT IF YOU SEE THE STORAGE UNITS FROM THERE, THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO HAVE,

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UM, ALSO THERE ARE, UM, BUFFER REQUIREMENTS, UM, IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE, UH, FOR THE PROPERTY, UM, ESPECIALLY ALONG THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY WHERE IT ABUTS THE A TWO ZONED PROPERTY.

UM, WE'RE LOOKING AT THAT CONCEPT PLAN, THE OUTDOOR STORAGE AREA, UM, BE REQUIRED TO HAVE A BUFFER BACK THERE.

UM, THERE WOULD BE A LANDSCAPE BUFFER.

UM, SO WE FEEL LIKE WE HAVE ADDRESSED IT FROM THAT ASPECT.

I, I JUST, I GUESS IF WE'RE NOT GONNA PUT, YOU KNOW, STRINGENT RESTRICTIONS ON THE BUILDINGS AND THE WALLS THAT THEY PUT UP OUT THERE, THAT EITHER WE MAKE IT WHERE THEY HIDE THE THING AND IT'S OUT OF VIEW OR TRY TO SET SOME BETTER STANDARDS FOR THESE THINGS.

WELL, FROM WHAT IT'S WORTH, I AGREE WITH YOU LOOKING FORWARD, I THINK WE OUGHT TO, I THINK WE OUGHT TO REVISIT THAT, UH, THAT, THAT THAT LIST OF CONDITIONS FOR THIS TYPE OF, UH, FACILITY.

'CAUSE IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT AN ORDINANCE ISSUE, RIGHT.

IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST PURELY THE LIST OF CONDITIONS, RIGHT? THAT'S CORRECT.

I, SO WHAT I, WHAT IT'S WORTH, I WOULD, I AGREE WITH THAT LOOKING, YOU KNOW, GOING FORWARD.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? I THINK WE NEED TO, HANG ON, HANG ON THAT THOUGHT AND TRY TO SEE IF WE CAN MAKE SOMETHING HAPPEN IN, IN THE FUTURE.

I KNOW WE'VE TRIED REALLY HARD UP INTO THE COUNTY WITH THIS, UH, ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW COMMITTEE AND LOOKING AT THAT, AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

UM, BUT I THINK MAYBE WHEN THE PLAN IS PRESENTED, YOU KNOW, WE ARE SAYING THAT WE WOULD LIKE FOR IT TO BE PLEASING TO THE EYE AND TO THE POTENTIAL COMMUNITY AROUND IT.

IT WON'T ALWAYS BE PINE TREES AND, AND, AND DUST.

UM, SO WE WILL, WE'LL, HOPEFULLY WE CAN WORK WITH THE APPLICANT ON THAT.

IF THERE ARE NO MORE QUESTIONS FOR, UH, MR. BASSETT, WE WILL, UH, ASK THE APPLICANT TO COME FORWARD AND MAKE ANY COMMENTS OR ANY RESPONSES, UH, MONDAY EVENING FOR EVERYBODY.

UH, LET ME ASK YOU TO DO THIS, UH, FOR THE RECORD, IF YOU'LL JUST GIVE US YOUR NAME AND YOUR ADDRESS.

MY NAME IS X-A-Y-M-A-N.

MY LAST NAME CHER AAL, S-H-A-I-K-H.

AND, UH, YOU WANT MY ADDRESS? WHICH ADDRESS YOU WANT? JUST NAME THE ADDRESS.

THE, WHERE IS THE I'M BUILDING THE STORAGE, YOU MEAN? UH, WHERE, WHERE WE GET IN TOUCH WITH YOU FOR, FOR THE RECORD.

WHERE, WHERE DO YOU LIVE? OH, I LIVE IN, UH, CHESTER.

LIKE, UM, I JUST MOVED TO THIS HOUSE.

I'M TRYING TO GET THIS, REMEMBER WITH THIS, UH, WAS IN, UM, ROOFERS BEND.

CHESTERFIELD, VIRGINIA.

AND WE TRY TO BUILD THAT STORAGE UNITS IS ACROSS FROM MY CONVENIENCE STORE.

I OWN A CONVENIENCE STORE DOWN THE ROAD FROM THAT, FROM THAT LOCATION.

AND WE OWN THE RESTAURANT TOOTH AND MCKINNEY AND WE LIKE TO HAVE THIS BUSINESS CLOSE TO OUR OTHER BUSINESS.

THAT WAY WE CAN TAKE CARE OF IT MORE CLOSE TO IT.

AND I DON'T HAVE NOTHING TO ADD TO MR. MARK FOR WHAT HE SAY.

NOW, YOUR CONVENIENCE STORE, IS THAT THE OLD ROBERT WALLACE STORE? NO, THE ACCIDENT STATION RIGHT OFF WHEN YOU ARE IN THE 85 FIRST EXIT.

AND MY, THE LOCATION IS ACROSS THE STREET FROM THE OTHER WAY FROM THE EXIT.

VERY GOOD.

YES, I HAVE A FOLLOW UP.

YOU SAID YOU HAD A RESTAURANT TOO? YES.

WHERE IS THAT? DAIRY FREEZE.

I DIDN'T REALIZE YOU OWNED THE DAIRY FREEZE.

WE OWN THE DAIRY FREEZE TOO.

I'M, I'M A CUSTOMER OF THE DAIRY FREEZE.

I DIDN'T, UH, YES, WE OWN THE DAIRY FREEZE AND WE THOUGHT ABOUT IT.

THIS THE, WE HAVE THAT PROPERTY LIKE ALMOST FIVE, SIX YEARS.

AND WE DECIDE TO DO SOME BUSINESS THERE BECAUSE IT'S CLOSE TO US.

WE CAN TAKE CARE OF IT QUICKLY.

CHESTER, CHESTER, VIRGINIA.

UM, I THINK NOW MAYBE WE WILL, UH, HAVE SOME DISCUSSION.

DO YOU WANT DISCUSSION AFTER THE PUBLIC HEARING? NO, I WANT, I DON'T ASK QUESTION.

OKAY, SURE.

YOU SAY YOU LIVE RIVERS BEND? YES.

RIVERS BEND.

UM, THEN YOU ARE FAMILIAR WITH THE TYPES OF, UM, WOULD IT BE OVERLAYS? YOU TALKING ABOUT THE START, I MEAN THE ARCHITECTURAL FACADE? YEAH, ARCHITECTURAL FACADES IN THE, IN, IN THE COMMUNITY.

UH, I'LL BE HONEST WITH YOU, THAT'S THE FIRST PROJECT I'VE BEEN DOING IT.

I'M STILL LEARNING ABOUT IT LIVE BY LITTLE WITH THE ENGINEERS AND WITH THE SURVEY

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GUY TOO.

AND, YOU KNOW, EVERY FIRST TIME I'M A BUILDING, LIKE THIS BUILDING, NORMALLY I BUY 'EM ALL THEM NEW OR IT IS ALREADY BEEN BUILT.

AND THIS ONE, I TRY TO BUILD IT FROM SCRATCH.

AS BASICALLY, I'M STILL NEW TO THIS PROJECT ANYWAY.

CAN I MAKE A SUGGESTION? YES, SIR.

NOT JUST, JUST, JUST A SUGGESTION FOR ME.

YEAH, NO PROBLEM.

GO AHEAD.

WHERE YOU LIVE, THERE'S CERTAIN DESIGN STANDARDS THAT ARE THERE IN THAT AREA.

WOULD YOU CONSIDER THINKING ABOUT MAYBE IN SOME WAY ADHERING TO ONE OF THOSE DESIGN STANDARDS FOR YOUR BUILDING WHERE YOU'RE PUTTING IT DOWN HERE IN MCKINNEY RIGHT OFF THE INTERSTATE? MM-HMM .

AND, AND MY MY REASON FOR ASKING YOU TO DO THE, FOR SUGGESTING YOU THINK ABOUT IT NOT ASKING YOU TO DO IT, I'M JUST ASKING YOU TO CONSIDER THINKING ABOUT IT WOULD BE THE FACT THAT TRAVELERS COMING, GOING SOUTH YES.

WOULD HAVE A BETTER CHANCE OF SEEING IT THAN THOSE COMING NORTH OFF, UH, WHERE THIS IS.

WELL, IT'S THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

IS IT THE OTHER WAY AROUND? MM-HMM .

WELL THIS IS A NORTHEAST QUADRANT.

SO IT WOULD BE, IT WOULD BE MORE VISIBLE NORTHBOUND THAN SOUTH NORTHBOUND SOUTHBOUND.

BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE GO THAT WAY.

BUT, BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE OKAY.

SO PEOPLE PASSING BY SEE IT, IT'S MORE LIKELY TO HELP THE AREA GROW BUSINESS WISE TO SEE SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

AND THAT'S, THAT'S DON'T, YOU DON'T, YOU DON'T HAVE, DON'T DON'T TRY IT.

DON'T TRY.

JUST CONSIDERING, YEAH.

JUST SUSTAIN.

NO, DON'T, DON'T.

THAT'S OKAY.

I GOT ONE MORE QUESTION.

UH, ARE THERE ANY PLANS FOR ANY, UH, CLIMATE CONTROL STORAGE UNITS THERE? UH, I SEE THAT THERE'S ROOM FOR EXPANSION.

I GUESS ACCORDING TO MR. BASS TO THE END, IF I FEEL LIKE WE NEED ONE, LIKE I STAR BUILD THEM ONE AT A TIME MM-HMM .

BY HOW GOING THE BUSINESS, IF I SEE PEOPLE LIKE STAR, LIKE ASK ME FOR CLIMATE CONTROL AND MY, I CAN SHIFT ONE OF 'EM, BE CLIMBING CONTROL TO THE, I MEAN, I KNOW IT'S AN ADDED COST.

YES, I GET THAT.

BUT I'M JUST ASKING IF THERE WAS ANY, ANY, UH, POSSIBILITY OR ANY PLANS TO DOING THAT GOING FORWARD.

AND IF, IF THERE IS, FINE, IF THERE'S NOT, THAT'S FINE TOO.

I JUST, YES.

AND I KNOW YOU ARE ASKING FOR, TO THE END OF THIS LAND AND OF THIS LAND, MY VISION TO THE ENGINEER, WHAT I'M PLANNING TO DO, IF IT FIT, I DON'T KNOW BY THE ENGINEER WHAT HE GO AND SAY.

AND MY, I'M GOING TO KEEP THE END OF THIS LAND, THE SPOTS FOR LIKE, UH, RV FOR BOATS FOR, UH, OUT, OUT OUTDOOR STORAGE, RIGHT.

WITH SHADE ON TOP OF IT TO THE, ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE END OF THIS LAND.

I DON'T WANT TO SHIFT THIS IN THE FRONT THAT WAY BE, IT CAN BE LOOKED BETTER WITH NOT CROWDY.

I KEEP THE CROWD ALL THE WAY IN THE BACK.

THAT WAY IT CAN BE LOOKED BETTER FROM THE I EXIT I 85 EXIT, UH, 42.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? JUST I GOT ONE.

ARE ARE THE, YOU SHOW A 22,500 SQUARE FOOT.

IS THAT A BUILDING? IS THAT JUST SPACE THAT YOU'RE GONNA, WE JUST SAID KEEP OPEN RIGHT NOW.

WE, WE, WHICH WE HAVE COUPLE OF OPTION TO DO.

THERE WAS MY, LIKE I HAVE A SIMILAR, I CAN SHOW YOU WHAT I HAVE HERE IF YOU INTERESTED TO LOOK AT IT.

MIGHT THIS HELP THE FIRST, I DON'T KNOW, LIKE THE FOOTAGE THERE BE FOR LIKE, I KNOW THERE'S SOME INDOOR STORAGE FOR RVS LIKE THAT.

IT'S VERY MUCH IS GOING GONNA BE SOME SIMILAR TO THAT ONE AND SIMILAR TO THAT ONE.

MAYBE TO THE, THE ONE ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE LEFT HAND SIDE.

WHILE WE'RE LOOKING AT THOSE, UH, ANY, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

IF WE HAVE SOME MORE QUESTIONS IN, IN A FEW MINUTES, WE'LL ASK YOU TO COME BACK.

UH, IT'S NOW TIME FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR

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THIS CASE.

IS ANYONE SIGNED UP? MR. GURLEY? NO.

MR. CHAIR THERE ISN'T.

THE PUBLIC HEARING IS CLOSED FOR THIS CASE.

UH, COMMISSIONERS, WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE? I HAD A FEW COMMENTS.

I GUESS, UH, I COULD START OFF, I'M SORT OF THE LOCAL PERSON I GUESS FOR THIS ONE.

BUT, UM, SO I'LL TELL YOU WHAT I THOUGHT ABOUT ON THIS THAT I VOTED FOR THE, UM, THE OTHER THREE, I THINK IT WAS THREE OTHER STORAGE FACILITIES, TWO AT DEWI AND ONE IN DENWOODY AS I RECALL.

AND I FELT LIKE THIS CASE IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT IN THAT IT'S, UM, I'LL SAY A SOMEWHAT MORE REMOTE AREA THAT MAKES IT A LITTLE DIFFERENT FOR ME.

THAT'S THE FIRST THING THAT HIT ME.

THE SECOND THING IS WE REZONED THE, UH, OTHER PROPERTY.

IF YOU REMEMBER, UH, ALL FOUR QUADRANTS HAD BEEN RE HAD BEEN ZONED BUSINESS BACK CIRCA 1970, WE'LL SAY 50 YEARS AGO.

AND IF YOU REMEMBER, IN ADDITION TO THE EXXON STATION, THESE GUYS CURRENTLY OWN, IT WAS A GULF STATION ACROSS THE STREET AND IT WAS A TEXACO STATION IN THE SOUTHWEST, SOUTHEAST QUADRANT RATHER.

BUT THERE WAS NEVER ANYTHING IN THE NORTHEAST QUADRANT.

I DON'T KNOW WHY, BUT THERE IS A FRONTAGE ROAD THERE AS WELL.

AND SO BEING, BEING REMOTE IS EVEN MORE IN MY TAKE ON IT IS EVEN MORE, UM, EXASPERATED BY THE FACT IT'S DOWN THE FRONTAGE ROAD.

IT'S NOT ON RIGHT.

40, BUT IT'S DOWN THE FRONTAGE ROAD.

SO THAT MAKES IT DIFFERENT TO ME.

AND MY TAKE ON IT IS THAT, AND I KNOW YOU OWNED EXXON, BUT NOT NECESSARILY THE LAND RIGHT AROUND IT, LIKE SAY BETWEEN YOU AND THE DUMPSTER AREA.

BUT, BUT I WOULD SAY ON THE EAST SIDE, I MEAN THE WEST SIDE RATHER THE WEST SIDE TOWARD MCKINNEY WOULD BE A BETTER PLACE WHERE IT'S MORE VISIBLE AND NOT, NOT REMOTE AS I SAID.

SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF MY TAKE ON IT.

AND THEN ONE THING THAT MARK SAID IN HIS PRESENTATION THAT HIT ME, UM, YOU KNOW, THE STANDARD VDOT STUFF IS ALWAYS MINIMUM, RIGHT? BUT WE ALWAYS TALK ABOUT WHAT'S THE TIPPING POINT OF SOMETHING TO MAKE SOMETHING CHANGE ON TRANSPORTATION.

YOU KNOW, A COUPLE CARS HERE AND A COUPLE HOSES THERE, AND ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU GOT A LOT OF TRAFFIC.

BUT THE ONE THING HE HIT ME THAT I HADN'T THOUGHT ABOUT TILL THE NIGHT WAS, UM, THE ADDITIONAL TRAFFIC, YOU WOULD PUT IT ACROSS THE THRESHOLD TO GET THAT ROAD PAID.

AND SO IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S ENOUGH TRAFFIC, IT'S PROBABLY GONNA BEAT IT UP TO WHERE IT'LL GET TO NEED TO GET PAVED.

AND THE FACT THAT THIS ONE ENTITY IS PUTTING IT ACROSS THAT TIPPING POINT, I THINK SHOULD BE A CONSIDERATION FOR A CONDITION.

I, I KNOW IT'S EXPENSIVE.

I'M, I'M, I'M JUST, I'M JUST THROWING THAT OUT THERE BECAUSE OTHERWISE THEN THE TAXPAYERS HAVE TO COME BACK AND, YOU KNOW, PAY IN ONE FELL SWOOP TO GET THAT, TO GET THAT ROAD REPAVED.

SO I THINK I'M, I HAVE TROUBLE WITH IT IN THAT SENSE THAT I THINK IT WOULD BE BETTER CLOSER TO YOUR OWN, UH, BUSINESS TODAY, EVEN THOUGH I REALIZE YOU MAY NOT OWN THAT LAND.

BUT, UM, I THINK BEING ON THAT SIDE IS BETTER AWAY FROM THE REMOTE AREA.

THAT AREA HAS BEEN RE WE'VE ALREADY TAKEN THE STANCE OF REZONING IT, THAT WHOLE QUADRANT FOR HUNDREDS OF ACRES, THOUSANDS OF ACRES IS AGRICULTURAL.

SO ALL THAT WOULD STAY CONSISTENT.

AND, UH, THE FACT THAT THIS REMOTE IS DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER ONES THAT, THAT AT LEAST I'VE VOTED FOR.

SO THAT, THAT'S MY 2 CENTS ON IT.

BRING IT BACK TO US FOR A FINAL VOTE.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? I GUESS I'D JUST MAKE THE COMMENT LIKE I DID THAT, YOU KNOW, AT WHAT POINT ARE WE GONNA POSSIBLY MAKE DIFFERENT STANDARDS FOR SOME OF THESE? MAYBE ASK FOR MASONRY WALL AROUND, OR AT LEAST ANY WALL THAT'S VISIBLE TO THE PUBLIC BE A MASONRY WALL.

I MEAN, I DON'T CARE IF IT'S CHAIN LINK BACK WHERE YOU CAN'T SEE IT.

UH, I GUESS TO MAKE THINGS A LITTLE MORE PLEASING, AESTHETICALLY PLEASING MM-HMM .

BECAUSE I, I DO SEE THAT AREA SOMEDAY GROWING UP AS AN INTERCHANGE WITH HOMES AND ALL THAT, BECAUSE IT'S NOT THAT HARD TO GET NORTH OF THERE AND TO BE IN A POPULATED AREA WITH STUFF THAT PEOPLE WILL SEE IT DESIRABLE.

WELL, I THINK FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE TRAVELING 85 GETTING ON AND OFF 85 THERE, IT WILL BECOME WHAT THEY REMEMBER ABOUT MCKINNEY.

THAT'S BE THE FIRST LAST THING THEY SEE WHEN THEY LEAVE MCKINNEY GOING NORTH WILL BE THAT.

UM, I'M, I'M WONDERING, UH, MR. BASSETT, IF IT WOULD BE MORE OF A HELP IF ONCE THE, UM, ONCE, ONCE THE IDEA HAVE BEEN, UH, RENDERED, PUT ON PAPER, UH, WITH SOME IDEA ABOUT WHAT IT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE, UM, WOULD, IT WOULD BE BETTER FOR US TO TABLE THIS NOW AND THEN ONCE WE HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF WHAT THE BUILDING'S GONNA LOOK LIKE AND, UH,

[00:30:01]

UH, I THINK, I THINK OUR QUESTIONS ARE VALID.

UM, WHAT DO YOU THINK? I MEAN, IS THAT WHAT, WHAT DO YOU THINK COMMISSIONERS, IT DOESN'T MATTER TO ME, BUT I DO THINK MOVING FORWARD WE NEED TO HAVE MORE STRICTER CONDITIONS LIKE HUDY SUGGESTED EARLIER.

YEAH, I AGREE WITH THAT.

HOW, HOW DO WE, HOW CAN WE, UM, IN INFLUENCE THOSE CON CONDITIONS, STRICTER CONDITIONS, THOSE, UM, I MEAN YOU COULD, YOU COULD CERTAINLY REVISE THE CONDITIONS THAT WE HAVE ADD TO THE CONDITIONS THAT WE HAVE THIS EVENING.

UM, I THINK IT'S DIFFICULT FOR THE APPLICANT TO, UM, I MEAN, I THINK HE COULD FURTHER DEFINE THE CONCEPT PLAN, UM, BUT IT'S GONNA TAKE MORE, UM, WORK FROM THEIR ENGINEER, UM, RELATED TO STORM WATER, THAT TYPE OF THING, EXACTLY WHERE THE BUILDINGS WOULD BE PLACED ON THE SITE.

I THINK SOME OF THE CONCERNS THAT YOU HAVE THIS EVENING, YOU CERTAINLY COULD FURTHER DEFINE IN THE CONDITIONS WITHOUT HAVING HIM, UM, RIGHT, RIGHT.

GET FURTHER INTO, UH, SITE DEVELOPMENT, A SITE DEVELOPMENT PLAN, UM, TO ADDRESS I THINK SOME OF THE CONCERNS THAT YOU HAVE.

I THINK, I THINK THOSE COULD BE ADDRESSED IN THE CONDITIONS, UM, WITHOUT HAVING HIM, UM, DO ADDITIONAL, UM, WORK WITH AN ENGINEER, UM, ON THE CONCEPT PLAN.

UM, BUT THAT'S CERTAINLY UP TO YOU ALL.

UM, IF YOU HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THAT, MR. , IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN STRENGTHEN NUMBER ONE? UH, LET'S SEE.

I MEAN THAT, I, I LIKE THE FACT THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PUTTING BRICK ON THE FRONT AND, UH, BUT I MEAN, YOU'RE GONNA SEE THE SIDES TOO.

I, I MEAN, WELL IF IT, IT SAYS, YOU KNOW, ANYTHING YOU CAN SEE, UH, VISIBLE FROM I FIVE, RIGHT.

OF WHERE, I MEAN, I'D ALSO, I PERSONALLY WOULD LIKE, UH, DEFENSE THAT CAN BE SEEN FROM BUCK SKIN AND FROM THE INTERSTATE TO BE A MASONRY FENCE.

OH, I SAID LIKE A WALL.

YEAH, LIKE A WALL.

I MEAN, WE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT, THEY'VE ALREADY TALKED IN HERE ABOUT PUTTING THE, UH, THE SLATS IN THE CHAIN LENGTH TO HIDE IT AND EVERYTHING.

WELL, WHY NOT JUST MAKE ONE GOOD WALL? I MEAN, GOOD WALLS THAT HIDE EVERYTHING.

AND THAT BE, WOULD THAT WALL NEED TO, I MEAN, UH, YOU, YOU WANT A NON-TRANSPARENT WALL YES.

ONE YOU CANNOT SEE THROUGH.

SO THAT COULD BE SEVERAL DIFFERENT MATERIALS.

WHEN I THINK ABOUT IT, I, I THINK ABOUT THE, UH, STORAGE FACILITY ON JEFF DAVIS, UH, NEAR THE WINERY THAT'S UP AT CHESTER.

THERE'S A STORAGE UNIT ALONG THAT ROUTE THROUGH THERE, AND IT'S ALL MASONRY WALL AROUND IT, UH, WITH COLUMNS EVERY SO OFTEN WITH A NICE TOP ON.

IT'S JUST AN, UH, IF YOU'RE GONNA LOOK AT A STORAGE FACILITY, IT'S A VERY PLEASING STORAGE FACILITY TO LOOK AT.

AND THAT'S KIND OF WHAT I'M ENVISIONING IN MY MIND.

NOW.

HOW DO YOU, HOW DO WE GET THERE? THERE THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE SOME AGREEMENT BETWEEN THEM AND US.

I MEAN, WE CAN PUT THE CONDITION ON IT.

IT'S A CONDITIONAL USE, SO WE DON'T HAVE TO ASK, WE CAN PUT THE CONDITION ON IT, BUT I'D RATHER IT BE SOMETHING THAT THE APPLICANT AND DENWOODY COUNTY CAN SHOW AS MAYBE A COLLABORATIVE EFFORT TO DO THE BEST WE POSSIBLY CAN.

WELL, I'M CERTAINLY OPEN FOR ANY SUGGESTIONS TO STRENGTHEN NUMBER ONE, BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE REALLY WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

DO YOU, UH, DO YOU WANT TO SAY, YOU KNOW, THAT WE WOULD STRONGLY ADVISE THE USE OF A, OF A WALL, UM, THEN YOU'D HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT HOW MUCH HEIGHT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE TO KEEP IT FROM BEING SEEN.

UM, WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE? WHAT YOU IIII, I MEAN, I'M, I'M LOOKING AT IT FROM A STANDPOINT AS A EXIT RAMP.

I MEAN, I, I, I DON'T

[00:35:01]

KNOW.

I MEAN, I CAN UNDERSTAND JEFF DAVIS HIGHWAY WITH A BRICK COLUMNS AND ALL THAT, BUT THIS IS, THIS IS A EXIT RAMP ROAD THAT, THAT YOU RIDE.

I THINK IT COULD BE DONE SOMETHING DIFFERENT OTHER THAN GOING TO THAT KIND OF EXPENSE FOR IT.

I, I, I JUST DON'T SEE IT.

WELL, I'D LIKE TO HIDE IT THEN, JUST YEAH.

PRETTY MUCH HIDE IT.

I UNDERSTAND.

IF THAT'S THE CASE, BUT TO, TO BUILD A MASONRY WALL, I MEAN, TO ME IT'S, I I, I THINK IT'S UNREASONABLE FOR ME TO ASK.

I MEAN, BUT IF THE BOARD, IF I, I'LL STAND BESIDE ON WHAT THE, UH, COMMISSION DECIDES.

WELL, AGAIN, UM, I THOUGHT WE WERE, EXCUSE ME, RIGHT HERE.

I I THOUGHT WE WERE, UM, SAYING THAT WE WANTED TO KIND OF LOOK AT THIS LITTLE DIFFERENT LOOK AT THIS GOING FORWARD, RE-LOOK AT IT GOING FORWARD.

I MEAN, I SEE IT AS YES, IT'S AN EXIT RAMP RIGHT NOW, BUT IS IT GONNA BE AN EXIT RAMP 10 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD OR JUST AN EXIT RAMP WITH NOBODY AROUND? I, I, I GET IT.

I, I, I GET THAT.

BUT WHERE IT'S LOCATED, IT CAN'T BE MUCH MORE THAN JUST THE EXIT RAMP UNLESS WE GET ENOUGH HEAVILY POPULATED TRAFFIC TO GO IN THERE TO WHERE WE GOT SOMETHING A WHOLE LOT MORE THAN ROUTE 40 AND 85.

AND I, YOU KNOW, WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY BEHIND IT? TOWARD THE, I GUESS THROUGH THE WOODS THERE TO BEHIND THE BUILDING? THERE'S A CUTTING TIMBER BACK IN THERE NOW.

I THINK THERE'S SEVERAL PEOPLE AT A HOSPITAL.

THE BUFFER ON THE FRONT ON BUCKSKIN ROAD, UM, FROM WHAT, 50 FEET, SEVEN, FIVE FEET TO A HUNDRED FEET ARE NOT REMOVING, UH, ALL THE VEGETATION, JUST ENOUGH OF THE RIGHT OF WAYS.

MAY I, MAY I SPEAK? YES, SIR, PLEASE.

I JUST COME TO REALIZE THAT THIS IS THE PROPERTY THAT MY WIFE'S FAMILY SOLD TO THE GENTLEMAN .

AND, UM, I THINK A COUPLE YEARS AGO THEY WERE, THEY WERE HERE, IF YOU CAN RECALL, REZONED IT.

THEY, WE HAD IT REZONED.

UM, AND, UM, IT, IT WAS INTENDED TO SELL RESIDENTIAL AND IT, IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

SO THESE GENTLEMEN CAME ALONG JUST SHEETLESS THIS PAST YEAR AND THAT THAT SETTLEMENT WAS, WAS MADE.

SO THEY, THEY PURCHASED IT.

AND SO, UM, TO, TO, TO LOOK AT IT FROM, UM, LANDSCAPING POINT OF VIEW, TO ME, IF YOU WERE TO EXIT OFF RIGHT NOW FROM, IF YOU ARE COMING FROM LAWRENCEVILLE SOUTHFIELD, YOU EXIT OFF.

UM, IF YOU LOOK STRAIGHT ACROSS IT, THAT IS THE PROPERTY RIGHT THERE.

AND IT'S, RIGHT NOW IT'S JUST WOODED LAND.

IT, IT, IT'S, ALL YOU CAN SEE IS TREES.

UM, IF YOU WERE TO CON CON GO STRAIGHT, CONTINUE ON TO DENWOODY PETERSBURG, IF YOU WERE TO LOOK OVER TO THE RIGHT SIDE OF IT, UH, IT'S QUITE A DISTANCE FROM, UM, FROM 85 AND, AND FROM 85 GOING.

IT'S NOT, IT'S NOTHING NOTICEABLE, YOU KNOW, TO THE RIGHT.

IT'S JUST TREES RIGHT NOW.

SO, I MEAN, IF THEY WERE TO, UM, IF THERE WAS A BUFFER AREA THERE WHERE THE BUILDING IS GONNA BE, AND THE TREES CAN PRETTY MUCH STAY IN THAT LOCATION, I DON'T SEE WHERE IT WOULD BE REALLY NOTICEABLE BY, AT THIS POINT IN TIME, EVEN ON 40 HIGHWAY GOING DOWN TOWARD, UM, STONEY CREEK.

IT, IT COULD EASILY BE HIDDEN IF IT WOULD JUST BE OVER IN AND THEN HAVE A BUFFER AREA WITH THE TREES REMAINING THE WAY THEY ARE, IT WON'T BE NOTICEABLE THAT, WELL, THAT MUCH AS OF RIGHT NOW.

NOW, IF THEY WERE TO GO AND CLEAN ALL THE TREES OFF AND THAT MAKE IT WIDE EVERY HERE, THEN YEAH, IT WOULD BE REALLY NOTICEABLE.

MR. MR. HALL, IF I COULD ASK AND HATE TO ASK YOU IN A PUBLIC SETTING, BUT I'M GOING TO, YOU, YOU AND YOUR WIFE DIDN'T BENEFIT.

WHO WAS THE FAMILY MEMBER? YOU SAID, EXCUSE ME? YOU SAID YOUR WIFE'S FAMILY SOLD THIS PROPERTY? YES, THE, THE GOOD ONE FAMILY.

DID, DID Y'ALL BENEFIT YOU AND YOUR WIFE FROM THIS? DID WE DO THAT? DID YOU BENEFIT FROM THE SALE? FROM THE SALE? YES, WE DID.

THEY DID? YES, THEY DID.

I DIDN'T.

SO YOUR WIFE DID? YES.

I, I WOULD RECUSE MYSELF FROM VOTING ON THIS MATTER THEN JUST TO BE SAFE, SO THANK YOU.

UM, SO NO, THAT'S OKAY.

MR. HARLE BE WITH THAT.

UH, WHAT, UH, MAKING A CONDITION, UH, CONCERN, MR. HOGGLE SUGGESTION ABOUT THE BUFFER, INCREASING

[00:40:02]

UH, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WOULD THE COMMISSIONERS WOULD LIKE TO SEE DONE? HAVE YOU VISITED IT? HAVE THEY VISITED THE SITE? YEAH, I THINK SOME OF THAT'S BEEN ALREADY, I, I DON'T THINK THERE'S A BUFFER THERE.

IS THAT, THAT WHERE THEY CUT, DID THAT COME UP THAT HIGH? I THINK SO.

I THOUGHT IT WAS TO THE, UH, NORTH OF THAT, BUT I DON'T KNOW.

WELL, WHAT IS YOUR PLEASURE? DO, UH, DO YOU WANT TO CHANGE ANY OF THE CONDITIONS TO ADD ANY, TAKE AWAY? ANY, HOW ABOUT ADDING A 50 FOOT BUFFER, 50 FOOT VEGETATIVE BUFFER? WHAT, WHAT, WHAT IS THE, UH, FRONT BUFFER DISTANCE, MR. BASSETT? UM, THE ONLY BUFFER THAT'S REQUIRED WOULD BE ALONG THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY.

UM, THAT'S ADJOINING THE, THE LARGE PARCEL TO THE EAST UHHUH.

SO IT WOULD BE TO THE EAST, UM, BECAUSE THAT'S ZONED A TWO AGRICULTURAL.

AND ALSO, UM, YOU CAN SEE THERE'S A LITTLE STRIP THAT COMES OUT, UM, JUST TO THE SOUTH OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UM, THAT COMES OUT TO BUCKSKIN DRIVE.

THEY'LL ALSO HAVE TO BE A BUFFER THERE BECAUSE THAT'S ALSO ZONED A TWO AGRICULTURAL.

UM, SO THEY'LL, THERE'S A BUFFER REQUIRED THERE, UM, UH, 25 FEET IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

SO THEY'LL HAVE TO DO PLANTINGS THERE TO BUFFER THE PROPERTY, UM, ALONG THE FRONT ALONG BUCKSKIN DRIVE.

UM, THERE WILL NOT, THERE'S NOT A BUFFER REQUIRED CURRENTLY BY THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

AND THEN TO THE NORTH, THERE WOULD BE NO BUFFER REQUIRED EITHER, UM, IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

SO ALONG BUCKSKIN DRIVE, THERE'S NO LANDSCAPE BUFFER REQUIRED.

UM, SO AS MR. TUSS INDICATED, UM, THAT'S WHY, UM, LIKE WITH OTHER APPLICANTS WE'VE HAD FOR MANY STORAGE FACILITIES, UM, WE'VE INCLUDED THAT WORDING THAT IF YOU CAN SEE THE, THE STORAGE BUILDINGS YOU'RE REQUIRED TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, A, A BRICK FRONT ON THOSE BUILDINGS, UM, IF YOU CAN SEE 'EM FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.

UM, AND ALSO MORE DECORATIVE FENCING ALONG THE, THE FRONT PORTION OF THE SITE, UM, THAT YOU CAN SEE FROM THE ROAD RIGHT AWAY.

UM, BUT AS MR. TUSS INDICATED, YOU KNOW, YOU ALL MAY WANNA PLACE AN, A ADDITIONAL LANGUAGE, UH, REMOVE THE EX THAT LANGUAGE AND JUST PUT THAT YOU'VE GOTTA HAVE A BRICK, UM, MASON, BRICK, MASONRY WALL ALONG THE ROAD, FRONTAGE THE FRONT OF THE PROPERTY, UH, TO ACT AS THAT BUFFER BETWEEN THE ROAD FRONTAGE AND THE, THE FACILITY.

I, OKAY.

UM, OR YOU COULD REQUIRE, UM, LANDSCAPING ALONG THAT FRONTAGE IN ADDITION TO THE MASONRY WALL.

YOU KNOW, THAT'S CERTAINLY CONDITIONS THAT YOU ALL COULD CONSIDER.

AND I KNOW YOU, YOU'VE HAD DISCUSSION THIS EVENING ABOUT THAT, MOVING RIGHT ALONG TRYING TO, UM, WHAT, WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE ABOUT ADDING LANGUAGE TO FURTHER SCREEN THE END OF THE PROPERTY? ADJOINING BUCKS AGAIN.

ALRIGHT, YOU, I KNOW WHAT YOU, YOU AT THIS POINT, I CAN'T SEE YOU FROM MY HOUSE, SO I MEAN, IF Y'ALL LIKE IT, Y'ALL OUT VOTE ME FOUR TO ONE, SO IT DOESN'T MATTER.

AND EVERY SO MANY FOOT ALONG THE FRONT WITH NICE GREENERY AND EVERYTHING ON THE, ON BUCKSKIN ROAD.

BUT I THINK, THINK GOING FORWARD, WE, I MEAN GOING FORWARD, IF WE'RE GONNA DO SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S GONNA SET A PRE I I SOMEWHAT OF A PRECEDENCE GOING FORWARD FOR STORAGE FACILITIES, I GUESS WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO LAST.

I MEAN, IF AT THE VERY LEAST IT WOULD BE NICE TO HAVE SOME LANDSCAPING AND AT LEAST A MORE DECORATIVE FENCE.

IF IT'S, IF IT WERE I PUTTING IT UP, IT WOULD BE A BRICK WITH WR IRON BETWEEN

[00:45:01]

I MEAN, I, THAT'S, TO ME IT WOULD BE, THAT'S THE LEAST I WOULD LIKE TO SEE.

I UNDERSTAND.

UM, AS, AS NUMBER ONE CONDITION IS, UH, UH, NOW IT SAYS SHALL BE CONSTRUCTED WITH A BRICK FRONT WITH EASE FOR THE PORTION OF THE BUILDING AND UNIT VISIBLE FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.

SO I GUESS DEPENDING ON HOW THE BUILDING WILL TURN, IF YOU COULD, IF THE TURN THE ANGLE, YOU KNOW, THEN THAT BRICK WOULD HAVE TO BE, WOULD WRAP AROUND THE FRONT THAT YES.

YES, MR. CHAIR.

SO IT'S ANY PORTION OF ANY PORTION OF THE STRUCTURES THAT ARE VISIBLE FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.

NOW WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BUCKS AGAIN.

YES, THAT'S CORRECT.

THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD HAVE TO MEET, UH, CONDITION NUMBER ONE.

AND I'M SURE THAT THE REVIEW COMMITTEE FROM YOUR OFFICE WILL PAY ATTENTION TO THAT.

CAN, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION, MR. MR. CHAIR IF I, YES SIR.

UM, THIS NUMBER ONE CONDITION IS, I SAID PROPERTY THAT THE VISIBLE FROM THE I 85 RIGHT OF WAY SHALL BE CONSTRUCTED WITH A BRICK FRONT AND UNITS VISIBLE FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.

IT'S AMBIGUOUS.

I CAN LEGALLY READ THAT.

THAT'S ONLY I 85 IF Y'ALL WANT IT FROM D FROM BUCKSKIN, I WOULD ADD AND BUCKSKIN I 85 AND BUCKSKIN THAT ARE VISIBLE FROM I 85 AND BUCKSKIN, UH, AND BUCKSKIN RIGHT AWAY? YES.

IF THAT'S Y'ALL'S INTENT.

IS THAT OKAY? YES.

CONDITION ONE, UHHUH? YES.

WE'LL TAKE THAT.

HE MUST HAVE WON HIS LAST CASE.

ALRIGHT, ANY, UH, ARE WE READY FOR A VOTE? UM, MOTION.

MOTION, UH, WOULD THAT CONDITIONAL CHANGE? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? THAT'S WHAT THE CHANGE, YEAH, MR. CHAIRMAN, BE IT RESOLVED, BUT IN ORDER TO ASSURE COMPLIANCE WITH VIRGINIA CODE SECTION 15.2 DASH, I CAN'T SEE.

22 8 6 A SEVEN.

IT IS STATED THAT THE PUBLIC PURPOSE FOR THIS, FOR WHICH THIS RESOLUTION IS INITIATED AS TO FULFILL THE REQUIREMENTS OF PUBLIC NECESSITY, CONVENIENCE, GENERAL WELFARE, AND GOOD ZONING PRACTICE, I MOVE A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT REQUEST C DASH 23 DASH TWO WITH REVISIONS, UM, BE PRESENTED, BE RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.

IS A SECOND.

EVERYTHING'S WORDED RIGHT? I, YES, I SECOND.

MOTION MADE.

AND SECOND THAT WE RECOMMEND THIS FOR APPROVAL TO BOARD SUPERVISORS, UH, MR. GER A VOTE.

YOU MEMBERS VOTING YES.

TWO MEMBERS VOTING NO.

C DASH 23 DASH TWO HAS BEEN APPROVED WITH REVISIONS TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.

IS THERE A DATE FOR THE, SO YOU'LL UNDERSTAND THE PROCESS? UH, WE MAKE A RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.

THEY WILL, UH, HEAR THIS CASE AGAIN WITH ANOTHER PUBLIC HEARING FOR ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO PARTICIPATE AND THEIR VOTE THAT NIGHT WILL BE THE FINAL VOTE ON APPROVAL OR NOT APPROVAL FOR THE PROPERTY.

WE JUST RECOMMEND TO THE BOARD.

MR. MR. DREWRY? I HAVE MARCH 21ST.

DOES THAT LOOK RIGHT TO YOU, SIR? SOUND? THAT'S CORRECT.

IT'S MARCH 21ST.

MARCH 21ST, 7:00 PM SAME LOCATION HERE.

BE APPROPRIATE BASED ON OUR COMMENTS.

MARCH 20, MARCH 21ST.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I'M SORRY WE TOOK AS MUCH TIME, BUT, BUT I THINK WE'VE COME UP WITH, WE'VE COME UP WITH A WORKABLE SOLUTION AND, UM, I DO HOPE THAT IN THE MEANTIME BETWEEN, UH, NOW AND MARCH 21ST, YOU'LL HAVE A CHANCE TO TALK ABOUT SOME OF WHAT YOU'VE HEARD TONIGHT, WHAT WE DISCUSSED, AND SEE WHAT KIND OF SOLUTIONS THAT YOU THINK WOULD

[00:50:01]

I KNOW HE TALKING ABOUT WALL AND IF YOU GO TO STORAGE UNITS IN D WITH THE COUNTY, NOBODY HAS A FANCY WALL EXCEPT LIKE IF YOU GO UP FAR IN RICHMOND MM-HMM .

OR WHEN JEFF DAVIS.

AND IF I WANT TO DO WALL THERE, BASICALLY HE GO AND COVER MY BUSINESS AND COVER MY STORAGE UNITS IS NOBODY.

GO AND LOOK AT IT.

MAYBE PEOPLE GO AND DRIVE IT THROUGH.

GO AND SEE THAT WALL THEM GO AND THOUGHT THE STATE DONE THIS BECAUSE NOT THE NOISE FROM THE CAR, GO TO THE NEIGHBORS AS BASICALLY THIS WALL IS GOING COVER THAT BUSINESS.

IF YOU DO NICE FANCY WALL WITH NOT VISIBILITY, WHAT YOU CAN SEE THERE.

END OF CASE NUMBER TWO DASH 23 DASH TWO.

[7.B. CASE P-23-2 CASE P-23-2. The applicant, Ruth E. Moogalian, and agent, Jeffrey M. Moogalian, are requesting to rezone property containing approximately 2.17 +/- acres from Business, Limited, B-1 to Business, General, B-2. The B-2 zoning district allows an automobile self-service station as defined in the Zoning Ordinance. The property is located at 20515 Cox Rd. (Route 460) North Dinwiddie, Virginia and is further defined as Tax Map Parcel No. 19-2-D. As indicated in the Dinwiddie County Comprehensive Land Use Plan, the subject property is located within the Route 460 Planning Area a portion of the Urban Area, which allows for business uses for this general area. ]

OUR NEXT CASE IS P DASH 23.

THERE'S TWO COMING UP.

CP HAS COME.

UH, 23 2, UH, MR. ROBINSON.

GOOD EVENING, MR. CHAIR AND MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION.

SO I'M GOING TO GIVE A BRIEF STAFF PRESENTATION FOR REZONING APPLICATION P DASH 23 DASH TWO FOR WHICH THE APPLICANT IS RUTH E ALION.

THE REQUEST IS TO REZONE, UH, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY FROM BUSINESS LIMITED B ONE TO BUSINESS GENERAL B TWO.

SO THE, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UH, IS LOCATED AT 2 0 5 1 5 COX ROAD, WHICH IS ROUTE FOUR 60.

IT'S LOCATED IN SUTHERLAND, VIRGINIA, AND MORE SPECIFICALLY IDENTIFIED IN THE COUNTY'S TAX RECORDS AS TAX MAP PARCEL 19 DASH TWO DASH D UH, IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

THIS PROPERTY IS LOCATED WITHIN THE URBAN AREA.

SO, UH, ON THE SCREEN IS A MAP SHOWING THE LOCATION OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY WITHIN THE SUTHERLAND AREA.

YOU'LL SEE THAT IT'S LOCATED ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF COX ROAD, ROUTE FOUR 60.

IT IS APPROXIMATELY 0.2 MILES WEST OF SUTHERLAND DRIVE, WHICH GOES INTO THE SUTHERLAND MANOR SUBDIVISION.

AND AGAIN, AS I JUST MENTIONED, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TO REZONE THIS PROPERTY FROM B ONE TO B TWO, UH, IN ORDER TO OPERATE AN AUTOMOBILE SELF-SERVICE STATION, WHICH IS THE TERM THAT THE ZONING ORDINANCE USES FOR A GAS STATION.

THE SUBJECT PROPERTY WAS REZONED TO B ONE IN 1972, AND IT WAS, THE PROPERTY WAS INITIALLY DEVELOPED AS A SUPERMARKET, UH, OR A GROCERY STORE, WHICH THE B ONE DISTRICT PERMITS BY.

DEVELOPMENT, BUT IN THE FAC UH, SUTHERLAND AREA IN THE VICINITY, THERE ARE OTHER BUSINESSES, UM, BUSINESS, CIVIC AND LIGHT INDUSTRIAL USES ALONG ROUTE FOUR 60.

UM, AT SOME POINT IN TIME, THE EXACT TIMEFRAME IS UNKNOWN.

THE APPLICANT BELIEVES IT TO BE AROUND 1980 POSSIBLY.

UM, BUT AT SOME POINT IN TIME, THE, UH, FUEL PUMPS WERE ADDED TO THE SITE, WHICH CHANGED THE CHARACTER OF THE SUPERMARKET INTO AN AUTOMOBILE SELF-SERVICE STATION, WHICH THE B ONE DISTRICT DOES NOT PERMIT.

UH, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY CEASED OPERATION ENCLOSED, UH, SOMEWHERE AROUND PRIOR TO THE, UH, 2020 PANDEMIC AND HAS BEEN VACANT SINCE THAT TIME.

UM, THE APPLICANT WAS INVOLVED WITH SOME, UM, A SITUATION WITH A FORMER TENANT IN THE BUILDING DURING THAT TIME.

AND THE PROPERTY HAS BEEN VACANT ACCORDING TO SECTION 22 DASH 2 46 OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

UH, IF ANY NONCONFORMING USE IS DISCONTINUED FOR A PERIOD EXCEEDING TWO YEARS AFTER THE ENACTMENT OF THE ORDINANCE FROM WHICH THIS CHAPTER DERIVES, OR ANY, OR AFTER ANY SUBSEQUENT ORDINANCE AMENDMENTS OF THIS CHAPTER, IT SHALL BE DEEMED ABANDONED AND ANY SUBSEQUENT USE SHALL CONFORM TO THE REQUIREMENTS OF THIS CHAPTER.

AGAIN, I JUST READ THE LANGUAGE DIRECTLY FROM SECTION 22 DASH 2 46 OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE REGARDING CEASING, UM, OF A NON-CONFORMING USE.

THEREFORE, THIS APPLICATION HAS BEEN SUBMITTED AND THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TO REZONE THE PROPERTY IN ORDER TO REOPEN THE BUSINESS AND OPERATE AN AUTOMOBILE SELF-SERVICE STATION, WHICH IS PERMITTED IN THE B TWO DISTRICT BY RIOT.

UH, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS SURROUNDED OR DIRECTLY SURROUNDED BY SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL

[00:55:01]

SO TO THE EAST, UH, LESS THAN ONE MILE FROM THE SUBJECT PROPERTY ARE, ARE THE, UH, DENWITTY COUNTY SPORTS COMPLEX, UH, SUTHERLAND ELEMENTARY SCHOOL AND THE WALMART DISTRIBUTION CENTER.

UM, THOSE AREAS ARE ZONED EITHER A TWO OR M1, WHICH IS, UH, INDUSTRIAL ZONING DISTRICT.

AND THEN, UH, WEST OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.

THERE, UH, IS, UH, A MIX OF USES INCLUDING CIVIC AND BUSINESS USES.

UH, A FARM MARKET AND VACANT RESTAURANT ARE ADJACENT TO OCRE UNITED METHODIST.

UH, THOSE PROPERTIES IS ON B ONE AND THEN A LITTLE BIT FURTHER WEST AT THE INTERSECTION OF CLAIBORNE ROAD AND ROUTE FOUR 60.

UH, THERE IS A, THERE ARE B TWO ZONE PARCELS THERE, WHICH CONTAIN THE, UH, SUTHERLAND PHARMACY AND THE SHELL GAS STATION.

AND IN BETWEEN THAT INTERSECTION IN THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, UM, ON HART ROAD, THERE ARE SOME B ONE'S OWN PROPERTIES IN THAT AREA AS WELL.

THERE'S A POST OFFICE THERE AND AN INSURANCE OFFICE.

SO, NEEDLESS TO SAY, THERE IS A MIX OF ZONING IN THE AREA.

THERE IS THE PRESENCE OF SOME B ONE AND B TWO IN THE AREA ALONG WITH, UH, A TWO AND OTHER RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS.

UM, AND AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS DESIGNATED BY THE COMP PLAN AS BEING WITHIN THE URBAN AREA, WHICH IS DESCRIBED AS, UH, CONTAINING MEDIUM TO HIGH DENSITY RESIDENTIAL, COMMERCIAL, AND INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT.

SEWER, WATER AND ROADS ARE AVAILABLE FOR FUTURE GROWTH WITH SOME UPGRADES AND EXTENSIONS NEEDED TO ACCOMMODATE HIGHER DENSITY RESIDENTIAL AND HEAVY COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT.

THE PROPOSED REZONING TO B TWO WOULD ELIMINATE THE NON-CONFORMING STATUS OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY AND ALLOW AN ESTABLISHED COMMERCIAL BUSINESS TO RESUME OPERATION.

SO TO SUMMARIZE THE IMPACTS OF THIS APPLICATION, UM, BECAUSE THE PROPERTY IS ALREADY DEVELOPED AND IT IS EXISTING, THERE WOULD BE NO IMPACT TO PUBLIC UTILITIES, SCHOOLS, OR PUBLIC SAFETY.

AND THE SAME WOULD BE TRUE FOR TRANSPORTATION IMPACTS.

AGAIN, THE PROPERTY IS ALREADY DEVELOPED, SO IT ALREADY HAS ENTRANCES FROM ROUTE FOUR 60.

SO BASED ON, UH, THE INFORMATION SUBMITTED, UH, STAFF HAS RECOMMENDED APPROVAL OF THIS REQUEST TO REZONE THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.

GIVEN THAT ONE, THE REQUESTED ZONING CLASSIFICATION OF B TWO IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE SURROUNDING ZONING PATTERN AND SURROUNDING LAND USES.

AND TWO, THE PROPOSED USE CONFORMS TO THE UNDERLYING USES RECOMMENDED IN THE URBAN AREA IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

SO THAT CONCLUDES OR SUMMARIZES MY STAFF PRESENTATION.

I CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE, AND, UH, THE APPLICANT IS PRESENT THIS EVENING AS WELL.

MR. JEFFREY ALION, QUESTION, COMMENTS? OKAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

WE WILL, UH, MAY I ASK THE APPLICANT TO COME FORWARD AND MAKE ANY COMMENTS THAT HE WOULD LIKE AND JUST GIVE US YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS PLEASE.

HEYDON.

MY NAME'S JEFFREY MCALLEN.

MY ADDRESS IS 2 45 EAST BROADWAY, APARTMENT 2 0 7, HOPEWELL, VIRGINIA, 2 3 8 6 7.

AND I KNOW THE ADDRESS OF THE PROPERTY.

2 0 5 1 5 COX ROAD.

I GOT A LITTLE, I'M JUST CONCERNED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT, MY DAD BOUGHT THE PROPERTY IN 1978, APPROXIMATELY IN 1980.

HE PUT GAS PUMPS THERE THAT THE, THAT COUNTY APPROVED BEFORE ANY OTHER GAS STATIONS WERE AROUND THERE.

FIVE FIRST AND, UH, NINE IN TWO.

ABOUT 2002 Y'ALL MIGHT KNOW.

THE UH, DEQ MADE.

EVERYBODY HAD, UH, STEEL TANKS.

YOU HAD TO TAKE 'EM OUT AND PUT FIBERGLASS, WHICH WE DID COST LIKE $60,000 BACK THEN.

AND THE COUNTY KNEW ABOUT IT 'CAUSE THE COUNTY UPGRADED ON THE, UH, ASSESSMENT ON THE PROPERTY.

SO EVERYTHING'S GOING ALONG.

AND I'VE BEEN HAVING, I DON'T KNOW IF Y'ALL KNOW MUCH ABOUT THE PROPERTY, ABOUT THREE YEARS AGO WE HAD A PERSON IN THERE TORE THE WHOLE BUILDING UP, TRY TO, WAS ON A SCAM, COST MY MOTHER 150,000 BUCKS, CHECK HIS NAME OUT.

HE'S GOT A LOT OF COURT RECORDS AND DATES.

BUT, UH, ANYWAY, I FINALLY FOUND SOMEBODY WHO WOULD LEASE THE PROPERTY.

SOMEBODY HAD SOME MONEY, GONNA PUT MONEY INTO IT, THANK GOD.

AND, UH, WHEN HE PUT THE APPLICATION, I ALREADY SIGNED THE LEASE WITH HIM.

EVERYTHING

[01:00:01]

GOT A LEASE MADE UP.

HE CALLS ME UP, HE SAYS, UH, THEY WON'T GIMME A BUSINESS LICENSE.

I WON'T GIVE YOU A BUSINESS LICENSE.

I CAN'T SELL GAS THERE.

I SAID, WHAT DO YOU MEAN? HE SAYS, THEY SAYS ZONED B ONE AND YOU CAN'T HAVE SELL GAS THERE.

I SAID, WE'VE BEEN SELLING THERE FOR OVER 40 YEARS.

WHY NOT NOW? I AIN'T GET NO NOTICE.

SO I CALLED MR. ROBINSON, SAID, WHAT'S THE SITUATION HERE? I SAID, I NEVER, HE SAYS, UH, YOU CAN'T SELL GAS THERE.

I SAID, WELL, IT'S BEEN SELLING THERE FOR 40 YEARS WITH CHANGES.

HE SAID, WE SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN ABLE TO.

AND I SAID, I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE DOING YOUR JOB, BUT FOR 40 YEARS WE'VE BEEN SELLING GAS THERE.

COUNTY KNEW IT.

WE REDID THE PUMPS, THEY JUMPED UP THE PROPERTY TAX ON THE BUILDING, 20 SOMETHING THOUSAND DOLLARS.

I FINALLY GOT SOMEBODY WHO GOT EQUITY BEHIND HIM TO GO INTO THE BUILDING AND BEEN SITTING THERE FOR, SINCE, UH, SINCE COVID 2020 JANUARY 6TH.

FINALLY GOT SOMEBODY IN THERE AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, WHAMMO, I CAN'T, UH, CAN'T GET A BUSINESS LICENSE.

SO HE CALLS ME, HE SAID, WELL, I'LL WAIT A LITTLE BIT, SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

BUT ANYWAY, HE BROKE THE LEASE WITH ME.

I GOT A BIG PROBLEM WITH THAT.

I MEAN, THAT WAS MONEY BE SUPPOSED TO STARTED PAYING FEBRUARY 1ST.

I GAVE HIM A FEW MONTHS FREE.

HE PULLED HIS WORKERS OUT THERE SINCE HE COULDN'T GET A BUSINESS LICENSE AND HAD TO GIVE HIM A 3000 NON-REFUNDABLE MONEY BACK DEPOSIT.

BUT I HAD TO GIVE IT TO HIM SINCE HE COULDN'T, NO, THE COUNTY WON'T GIVE HIM A BUSINESS LICENSE.

I DON'T WANNA GET SUED.

I GOT ENOUGH.

MY MOTHER JUST PASSED AWAY JANUARY 1ST.

I'M OWN THE BUILDING.

UH, I I JUST FEEL THE COUNTY.

SOMETHING'S WRONG HERE FOR 40 YEARS, YOU COULD DO SOMETHING.

NOTHING CHANGED.

HE TOLD ME I HEARD SOMEBODY, MR. ROSS SINCE 1972, BUT ALL I HEARD WAS 1964.

NOTHING REALLY BEEN CHANGED IN THAT ZONE THAT YOU TOLD ME.

SO I'M THINKING IF NOTHING CHANGED SINCE 1964, WHAT'S THE BIG DEAL NOW? HE SAYS THAT'S THE WAY IT IS.

I THINK NOW, AND I EVEN, I DON'T KNOCK HIM.

I TOLD HIM, YOU'RE DOING YOUR JOB.

I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT MY OWN OPINION, THAT'S YOUR PERCEPTION OF WHAT YOU'RE READING.

OKAY? FOR 40 YEARS, PEOPLE HAVE BEEN READING A DIFFERENT WAY.

IT COST ME $7,500 THIS WEEK.

WELL, LAST FEW WEEKS I HAD TO PAY 'EM A $3,000 DEPOSIT BACK.

I HAD TO PAY $1,500 TO GET SOMETHING REZONED.

DON'T THING NEEDED ME TO REZO.

UH, I WAS SUPPOSED TO START GETTING $2,500 RENT FEBRUARY 1ST.

ALL THAT'S SHOT.

AND WHO KNOWS HOW LONG IT CAN TAKE ME TO GET SOMEBODY TO GET INTO THERE.

I HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE WANNA LEASE IT, BUT THEY DON'T HAVE FUNDS BACKING THE LAST GUY.

I LET HIM, THAT FUNDS BACKING HIM COST ME $150,000.

AND I, AND I HEARD THE LEASE.

HE, HE CAME TO MY HOUSE JANUARY 20TH, LEASE TERMINATION AGREEMENT.

HE HAD TO.

NO.

IS THIS, WAS THIS A REZO REZONING REQUEST? WOULD THAT SOLVE THE ISSUE OF I DON'T SEE, IT'LL COME BACK.

I'M STILL GONNA HAVE A PROBLEM.

WELL, I KNOW, BUT I'M SAYING I, I, YEAH, I WANNA GET IT.

YEAH, I WANT GO FORWARD WITH IT.

BECAUSE I MEAN, TO ME, THAT'S THE ONLY RECOURSE THAT WE HAVE AT THIS POINT.

BUT, BUT MY THING, THE QUESTION WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, AND I, YOU KNOW, AND I, I TOLD, ASKED, TOLD MR. ROBINSON, I FELT HE WANTS TO SPEAK TO MS. HIS BOSS.

HE SAID, BOSS LAID IT IN MY HAND.

I SAID, I UNDERSTAND, I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE DOING YOUR JOB.

I UNDERSTAND THAT.

OKAY, WE, WE'VE GOT THAT PART, BUT, BUT I CAN'T SEE HOW 40 YEARS DOING.

I UNDERSTAND A SUDDEN, BAM, BE JUST AS FRUSTRATED AS YOU ARE.

I DON'T THINK THE SOUL HAS HEARD WHAT YOU SAID WOULDN'T BE FRUSTRATED.

UH, BUT HOW, HOW CAN WE BEST FIX IT GOING FORWARD? WELL, THE ONLY THING I CAN DO NOW, I WANT TO GET, GOTTA GET IT REZONED BECAUSE OKAY, I AIN'T GONNA FIGHT THE COUNTY.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN LATER MM-HMM .

BUT RIGHT.

I DON'T WANNA FIGHT THE COUNTY.

AND WHO KNOWS.

I CAN EVEN ASK GUYS.

I SAID, LOOK, I CAN THIS DONE REAL QUICK.

WILL YOU STILL BE INTERESTED? HE SAID, CALL ME.

NOW I'M STILL HOPING ON THAT.

NOW IF HE DON'T COME THROUGH, I GOT A BIG, I'M GONNA HAVE A BIG PROBLEM.

A BIG PROBLEM.

ANY ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS FOR MR. GELIAN? I MEAN, THOUGHT PROCESS IS YOU JUST WANT TO OPEN IT UP AND BE ABLE TO SELL GAS THERE.

WELL, THAT'S WHAT THE PLACE BEEN FOR 40 YEARS.

I MEAN, I, I LIVED THREE HOUSES DOWN OKAY.

ALL MY LIFE.

YOU KNOW THE SITUATION SINCE I WAS A KID.

I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE, WHAT YOU'RE TALKING

[01:05:01]

ABOUT.

AND IF YOU'RE LOOKING TO, TO GET IT REZONED TO BE TWO SO THAT YOU CAN SELL GAS AND HAVE A QUICKIE, MARK, WHATEVER YOU WANNA CALL IT, PUT IN THERE, THEN LET'S GET IT REZONED FOR YOU.

THAT'S WHAT I'M GONNA DO.

BUT I, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, I'M DISCONTENT WITH I UNDERSTAND IT'S BEEN 40 YEARS CAN DO.

ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU'RE TELLING THAT EVEN GIVING ME A NOTICE, YOU KNOW, AT LEAST, NO, I'M PAYING PROPERTY TAX ON IT.

UH, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? MR. THANK YOU VERY GO RIGHT AHEAD.

YOU CAN HAVE LIKE A, LIKE, IT'LL BE LIKE A CONVENIENCE STORE.

WITH GAS IT YEAH, IT'D BE, YEAH.

LITTLE EVERYTHING.

LET, YEAH.

IT'S PRETTY BIG BUILDING.

I MEAN, I MIGHT EVEN DIVIDE IT UP.

I DON'T KNOW.

WHOA, WHOA, WHOA, WHOA.

UM, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

WE, WE'VE HEARD YOU LIGHT AND CLEAR.

WE'VE HEARD YOUR POINTS ARE WELL MADE.

MR. JOHNSON, MR. ROBINSON.

UH, SO WE WILL CALL FOR DISCUSSION AMONG THE PLANNING COMMISSIONERS AND, AND LEAD TO A VOTE FOR APPROVAL ON DISAPPROVAL, UM, PUBLIC HEARING.

MR. JOHNSON.

OH, I'M SORRY.

I PUBLIC HEARING IT'S MY FAULT.

UH, YOU, YOU CAN HAVE A SEAT IF YOU LIKE IT.

YOU'VE BEEN STANDING UP.

IT'S TIME FOR ANY QUICKER OR BETTER.

I APPRECIATE IT.

I CAN GOTCHA.

, ANYONE SIGNED UP FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING? MR. NO ONE SIGNED UP FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING.

PUBLIC HEARING.

IT'S CLOSED.

AND NOW NOW'S TIME FOR DISCUSSION.

THANK YOU MR. JOHNSON.

MR. ROBINSON, PLEASE FORGIVE ME FOR YES, SIR.

IT WAS BUILDING WAS CLOSED IN JANUARY OF 2020.

RIGHT? I I WAS READING IT WAS A NON, SOMETHING ABOUT A NON-CONFORMING USE.

WAS THAT THE SELLING OF GAS? THAT'S CORRECT.

SO IT WASN'T, IT WAS NOT ZONED FOR THEM TO SELL GAS, BUT THEY WERE SELLING GAS, WHICH WAS NON-CONFORMING USE.

CORRECT.

AND NOW WE'RE GOING TO MAKE IT LEGAL TO SELL THE GAS.

THAT'S CORRECT.

THAT'S WHAT WE ASKED IT TO DO.

THAT'S CORRECT.

I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I UNDERSTOOD EVERYTHING.

I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I'M TRYING TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS QUESTIONS, COMMENTS THAT MAKE TIME.

UM, JANUARY 20TH.

DO YOU KNOW JANUARY 6TH, 2020 BID HAD CLOSED DOWN? UH, COVID, BUT THE COVID, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS, IT WAS KNOCKING THE COURT CASES BACK.

IT TOOK A YEAR TO GO TO COURT TO GET THE EVERYTHING DONE.

AND I WAS EXPLAIN TO MR. ROBINSON TO FORGET THE TIME THE COURT WITH CASE WAS DONE.

NOW, HEY, THIS GUY'S GONNA START SELL GAS FOR TWO ODD YEAR.

HE SAID, WELL, WE DON'T HAVE NO PROVISION FOR THE COVID AND I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT LITTLE ENCY, I COULDN'T DO NOTHING WITH THAT BUILDING FOR THE WHOLE YEAR UNTIL THAT MIGHT COURT CASES WERE DONE.

I COULDN'T SELL IT.

I COULDN'T DO NOTHING.

I HAD GO THROUGH THE COURT PROCESS.

IT TOOK COUNTY TO LOOK AT THE, APPROXIMATELY A WHOLE YEAR.

SO THAT'S, THAT'S PART OF THE TWO YEARS.

GOTCHA.

AND, AND THE COUNT.

AND, UH, WHEN I MENTIONED THAT THERE WAS NO PROVISION FOR THAT, SO OUTTA LUCK.

BUT THERE, WE, WE ARE GONNA TRY TO DO THE BEST WE CAN TO DO THE BEST.

WE CAN MOVE AHEAD FROM THIS POINT.

MR. UH, ANYBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? MR. CHAIRMAN JUST, OH, I'M, I'M SORRY.

TO MR. ROBINSON, I'M CORRECT THAT THIS IS BEING DOUBLE ADVERTISED FOR THE BOARD MEETING.

I WAS JUST ABOUT TO MAKE THAT COMMENT IN AN EFFORT TO HELP THE APPLICANT, THIS HAS BEEN SCHEDULED FOR THE BOARD SUPERVISORS MEETING THIS MONTH.

SO, OKAY.

HE, AFTER TONIGHT, HE WOULD APPEAR BEFORE THE BOARD ON FEBRUARY, UH, 21ST.

I BELIEVE THAT'S CORRECT.

SO WE'VE MOVED IT UP A MONTH THOUGH.

YOUR FUTURE PROSPECT, HE MAY, ONCE HE HEARS THAT, YOU KNOW, MAY, UH, WORK WITH YOU.

ANY MOTION? I'LL MAKE A MOTION.

OUR NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS OLD BUSINESS IS THE, UH, CONTINUATION OF THE CASE WE HEARD LAST MONTH, AND THAT WAS TABLED, UH, CASE NUMBER C DASH 23 DASH THREE, AND MR. ROBINSON'S IS GONNA GIVE US A BRIEF UPDATE ON THAT.

BE RESOLVED THEN IN ORDER TO ASSURE COMPLIANCE WITH VIRGINIA CODE SECTION 15.2 DASH 2 2 8 6 A SEVEN.

IT'S STATED THAT THE PUBLIC PURPOSE FOR WHICH IS RESOLUTION IS INITIATED, IS TO FULFILL THE REQUIREMENTS OF PUBLIC NECESSITY, CONVENIENCE, GENERAL WELFARE, AND GOOD ZONING PRACTICE.

I MOVE THAT REZONING, P DASH 23 DASH TWO BE RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.

PI PS 23 DASH TWO HAS BEEN APPROVED TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, BUT THE FEBRUARY 21ST MEETING.

[01:10:02]

THANK YOU, MR. GOLE.

UH,

[8. OLD BUSINESS ]

GOOD EVENING AGAIN, MR. CHAIRMAN AND MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION.

SO BASICALLY I JUST WANT TO, UM, TOUCH ON SOME OF THE REVISED CONDITIONS, UM, THAT YOU HAVE IN THE STAFF REPORT.

SO IN THE LAST STAFF REPORT, THERE WERE EIGHT CONDITIONS AND WE'VE SORT OF REWORKED THEM AND REVISED THEM.

SO NOW YOU HAVE A TOTAL OF 13 CONDITIONS INSTEAD OF EIGHT CONDITIONS.

SOME OF THE ORIGINAL ONES THAT WE PROPOSED, WE'VE TAKEN OUT BECAUSE THEY WERE SORT OF REPEATING, UM, CONDITIONS THAT WERE ALREADY IN THAT LIST.

UM, SO ONE OF THE MAIN CONDITIONS I WANNA POINT OUT TO YOU IS, UH, CONDITION NUMBER THREE, UH, WHICH BASICALLY TIES THE, UH, THE PROJECT TO THE APPLICANT'S RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT YOU HAVE IN YOUR PACKET.

AND THEN I WOULD LIKE TO MENTION A COUPLE OF, UH, COMMENTS FROM THE APPLICANT.

UH, THE APPLICANT HAS DISCUSSED THESE CONDITIONS WITH US SINCE YOU'VE RECEIVED THE PACKET AND WOULD JUST LIKE TO MENTION SOME OF THESE COMMENTS TO YOU, UH, ON CONDITION NUMBER FIVE.

UM, SO THE FIRST SENTENCE IN THAT CONDITION WAS IN, IN THE PREVIOUS CONDITIONS.

AND WE'VE ADDED THE, THE LAST TWO SENTENCES.

UM, THE APPLICANT HAS MENTIONED THAT IT WOULD BE IDEAL THAT THE FIRST STATEMENT THAT TALKS ABOUT THE CAMPGROUND ONLY BEING OCCUPIED BY PERSONS IN CAMPING UNITS, UH, WOULD LIKE, UH, SOME FLEXIBILITY THAT THAT DOES NOT APPLY TO MANAGERS AND EMPLOYEES ON THE SITE.

SO THAT WAS ONE COMMENT EXPRESSED TO STAFF.

AND NUMBER SIX, UM, THE, AGAIN, THE FIRST STATEMENT WAS IN THE PREVIOUS LIST OF CONDITIONS, AND WE'VE ADDED THE, THE SECOND TWO SENTENCES.

THE LAST SENTENCE TALKS ABOUT, UM, PROHIBITING PORTABLE WASTE WATER COLLECTION TANKS.

UH, THE APPLICANT HAS EXPRESSED TO STAFF THAT, UM, MAYBE TO PROVIDE A, A PROVISION FOR ACCEPTING CASE OF EMERGENCIES, UH, JUST TO ALLOW, UM, IN CASE THERE IS A SITUATION OR AN EMERGENCY ON SITE, UM, THE APPLICANT WOULD LIKE SOME FLEXIBILITY THERE.

AND THEN, UH, FOR CONDITION NUMBER 11, THIS IS A CONDITION THAT WE'VE ADDED, UH, THAT WAS NOT IN THE PREVIOUS STAFF REPORT.

UM, AND BASICALLY IT'S JUST PER, UM, THE REQUIRING THAT THE OPERATOR, CAMPGROUND OPERATOR PROVIDE A POINT OF CONTACT.

AND, UH, THERE'S A STATEMENT THERE THAT SAYS, UM, UH, THE DESIGNEE WILL BE AVAILABLE IN PERSON AND BY PHONE.

AND THE APPLICANT HAS EXPRESSED THE STAFF, UH, UH, PREFERENCE THAT IT READ AVAILABLE IN PERSON OR BY PHONE.

WHICH ONE ARE YOU READING, SIR? UH, CONDITION NUMBER 11.

SO, UH, SHALL WE PLACED IN THE CAMPGROUND? UM, AM I LOOKING AT THE WRONG ONE? UM, PAGE SIX.

PAGE OH, PAGE SIX.

DID, IF I INTERRUPT, DID EVERYBODY GET A COPY OF AND READ THE COPY OF THOSE NEW RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT WERE SENT IN OUR PACKET LAST WEEK? YEAH, I GOT IT.

SO I JUST TOUCHED ON, UM, CONDITIONS NUMBER FIVE, SIX, AND 11 THAT WE HAVE DISCUSSED WITH THE APPLICANT, UM, SINCE YOU ALL RECEIVED THE PACKET.

UM, THAT WAS THE COMMENTS THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO PROVIDE ON THOSE CONDITIONS.

BUT THAT BASICALLY CONCLUDES MY, UM, PRESENTATION JUST TO UPDATE YOU ALL WITH THE LIST OF REVISED CONDITIONS THAT YOU HAVE.

UH, WE'VE ATTEMPTED TO ADDRESS YOUR CONCERNS AND WE DID TIE, UM, THROUGH CONDITION NUMBER THREE.

WE DID TIE THE PROJECT TO THE APPLICANT'S RULES AND REGULATIONS, UM, WHICH ARE AN ATTACHMENT, AND THE RULES ON LAKE REGULATIONS COVER, UM, A LOT OF THE THINGS IN THE CAMPGROUND REGARDING, UM, NOISE, UM, JUST APPEARANCE OF THE CAMPSITES.

UM,

[01:15:01]

SO THAT IS THE APPLICANT'S LATEST REVISED RULES AND REGULATIONS, AND THEY HAVE BEEN REVISED SINCE THE LAST MEETING.

AND THOSE, THE LATEST REVISIONS ARE NOT WRITTEN IN HERE.

UH, CAN YOU REPEAT THAT QUESTION? THE LATEST SUGGESTED REVISIONS ARE NOT WRITTEN IN HERE, ARE THEY? CORRECT.

BECAUSE WE HAVE DISCUSSED THAT WITH THEM SINCE YOU RECEIVED THE PACKET.

SO THAT'S COMMENTS THEY WOULD LIKE YOU TO BE AWARE OF WITH THESE CONDITIONS.

WELL, I DON'T HAVE 'EM WRITTEN, RIGHT? CORRECT.

MR. ROBINSON, I DO NOT HAVE THEM WRITTEN DOWN, DO I? THAT'S CORRECT.

HE HAS THE RULES AND REGULATIONS.

MR. CHAFF, I MAY AREN'T THE RULES AND REGULATIONS IN THAT PACKET? YES.

I'M NOT SURE WHAT, SO I'M CONFUSED.

HE, HE'S, OKAY.

THAT'S WHAT HE'S THAT'S WHAT I'M, I THE QUESTION WAS THE SUGGESTIONS, THE SUGGESTED ADJUSTMENTS THAT HE READ TONIGHT AND I ASKED, THEY'RE NOT WRITTEN DOWN IN OUR PACKETS, AND HE SAID THAT'S RIGHT, DIDN'T YOU? THAT'S CORRECT.

I, I'M CONFUSED.

I GOT YOU.

SO THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT? YES.

SEE, I WAS THINKING THE REVISIONS WERE FROM O AND ABOVE LAST TIME.

I I JUST, I I JUST WANTED KNOW, YOU JUST CONFUSING ME, YOU KNOW? YEAH, I LIKE DOING THAT.

ANYWAY.

UH, SO ANY COMMENTS, QUESTIONS, MR. ROBINSON? UM, THAT CONCLUDES WHAT STAFF WANTED TO PRESENT THIS EVENING, BUT THE APPLICANT DOES HAVE A PRESENTATION THEY WOULD LIKE TO PRESENT TO YOU ALL.

WITH ADDITIONAL INFORMATION IF THERE NO QUESTION OR COMMENTS AT THIS POINT, UH, TIME FOR THE APPLICANT.

1503 BLACKHEATH ROAD, MIDLOTHIAN, VIRGINIA.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

AND IF THE APPLICANT, UH, MR. KNAPP OR YOUR, UH, AGENT WOULD COME.

AND AGAIN, FOR THE RECORD, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS PLEASE.

JACK AND DEBBIE KNAPP.

OKAY, GOOD EVENING.

WE WOULD LIKE TO START BY GIVING A SINCERE APOLOGY APOLOGY FOR THE LACK OF A PRESENTATION TO YOU LAST MONTH.

HAVING NEVER DONE ANYTHING LIKE THIS BEFORE, WE WERE CLUELESS ABOUT HOW THIS WOULD GO.

AND HINDSIGHT BEING WHAT IT IS, WE DID A POOR JOB PRESENTING OUR VISION FOR PEACEFUL PINES RV PARK.

IF YOU'LL INDEL JUST FOR 10 MINUTES, WE WILL PRESENT A BETTER VISION AND THEREFORE ALLEVIATE ANY FEARS YOU MAY HAVE SO THAT YOU TOO WILL GET EXCITED ABOUT OUR RV PARK COMING TO DENWITTY.

THE INSPIRATION FOR OUR DESIGN CAME FROM AN ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEER SITE IN ALABAMA.

WE LOVE THE SPACE AS WELL AS THE ESTABLISHED TREES, BLOCKING SIGHT AND SOUNDS OF NEIGHBORS.

WE HAVE NO INTEREST IN BECOMING LIKE ANY OF THE OTHER FOUR CAMPGROUNDS IN DENWITTY.

SO MUCH SO THAT WE PUT STRICT RULES AND REGULATIONS IN PLACE THAT ARE NOW CONDITIONS IN THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT TO PREVENT THIS FROM HAPPENING, WHICH RIDES IN PERPETUITY WITH THE PROPERTY LOCATED ON 184 ACRES.

WE WANT SPACE BETWEEN OUR SITES 80 FEET OF SPACE, AND WE HAVE PLENTY OF ROOM TO ALLOW FOR THIS.

LAST MONTH WE LISTED, WE LISTENED TO YOUR CONCERNS.

AND WHILE WE HAVE ALWAYS INTENDED TO HAVE THE POLICIES, WE DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THEY NEEDED TO BE PART OF THE CUP.

WE'D LIKE TO SHOW YOU HOW AND WHERE WE HAVE PLACED THESE RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT WILL BE PART OF THE CUP.

QUIET HOURS ARE ADDRESSED ON PAGE ONE.

UNDER GENERAL PARK RULES NUMBER ONE, QUIET HOURS ARE 11 TO SEVEN.

THIS IS STRONGER THAN THE COUNTY REQUIREMENTS WHERE QUIET HOURS DON'T START UNTIL MIDNIGHT.

RULES AND REGULATIONS, PAGE THREE, NUMBER THREE, STATES NO VACANT RVS MAY BE KEPT ON INDIVIDUAL SITES.

WE HAVE A SECTION OF OUR PROPERTY DESIGNATED FOR RV STORAGE.

WE MAKE IT CLEAR TO OUR GUESTS THAT THEY CANNOT LEAVE THEIR RVS SET UP FOR WEEKEND USE ONLY RULES AND REGS.

PAGE THREE, UNDER RVS AND VEHICLES, NUMBER FIVE, STATES RVS FOR WEEKEND USE ONLY SHALL NOT BE KEPT CONTINUOUSLY ON INDIVIDUAL SITES.

AGAIN, THEY'RE WELCOME TO UTILIZE THE RV STORAGE AREA.

WE HAVE DONE MOUNDS OF RESEARCH TO GET TO THIS POINT AND KNOW THAT LONGER STAYS ARE BETTER FOR THE COMMUNITY AND IDEAL FOR OUR PARK.

OUR TARGET MARKET HAS A HOUSEHOLD INCOME BETWEEN 102 HUNDRED 50,000.

LOCATING A VACANT CAMPSITE IS NO EASY TASK THERE CURRENTLY 1.6 MILLION

[01:20:01]

RV CAMPSITES IN THE UNITED STATES AND A RECORD 11.2 MILLION HOUSEHOLDS OWN RVS.

THIS IS ACCORDING TO 2021 DATA FROM THE RV INDU INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION.

ABOUT 400,000 OF THOSE RV OWNERS ARE CONSIDERED FULL-TIME RVS.

OUR IDEAL GUEST ARE THE CONSTRUCTION WORKER AT FORT LEE OR ONE OF THE NEW DISTRIBUTION CENTERS COMING TO THE AREA.

A NURSE SERVING A CONTRACT FOR THREE OR SIX MONTHS AT SOUTHSIDE REGIONAL MEDICAL CENTER OR ST.

MARY'S OR CHIPPENHAM OR JOHNSTON WILLIS, OR ONE OF THE OTHERS.

A CONTRACTOR THAT WORKS FROM HOME RETIREES WHO LOVE THE FOUR SEASONS.

VIRGINIA HAS TO OFFER A SOLDIER STATIONED AT FORT LEE FOR A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME, A HOMESCHOOL FAMILY WHO WANTS TO EXPLORE GREATER CENTRAL VIRGINIA HISTORY AND ALL THAT.

IT HAS TO OFFER AN ENGINEER WORKING FROM HOME WHO STOPS IN WITH THIS FAMILY TO EXPLORE THE LOCAL SITES.

OUR PARK WILL BE STATE OF THE ART AND WILL OFFER HIGH SPEED BROADBAND INTERNET, SOMETHING THAT DENWITTY DOESN'T CURRENTLY OFFER IN THIS AREA.

THIS INTERNET WILL BE A HUGE SERVICE TO THOSE WORKING FROM HOME AT OUR PARK.

OUR RULES AND REGULATIONS ARE IN PLACE TO MAKE SURE RVS ARE IN GOOD CONDITION, OUR NEAT AND CLEAN, THAT WE HAVE GOOD NEIGHBORS.

WE WON'T TOLERATE FOLKS THAT WON'T ABIDE BY THE RULES.

THIS IS MY BACKYARD.

AND THE RV MUST CONTINUE TO LOOK GOOD THROUGHOUT THE DURATION OF THEIR STAY.

THE WAY WE ENSURE THIS WILL HAPPEN IS THROUGH OUR WRITTEN RULES AND REGULATIONS, WHICH ARE PART OF THE CUP PAGE TWO.

UNDER RVS AND VEHICLES.

NUMBER ONE, RVS HAVE TO BE WELL MAINTAINED AND CLEAN FREE OF MOLD AND MILDEW MUST BE CLEAN AND IN GOOD CONDITION.

NO WINDOW AC UNITS.

NUMBER ONE C ONSITE REPAIRS WHILE NOT PROHIBITED, ARE DISCOURAGED AS RVS AND VEHICLES SHALL BE OPERATIONAL AND REMAIN OPERATIONAL.

MAJOR REPAIRS ARE PROHIBITED.

RVS AND VEHICLES SHALL BE OPERATIONAL AT ALL TIMES UNDER SITES.

NUMBER TWO, AS ALL SITES PROVIDED ARE RELATIVELY FLAT, RVS SHALL BE GROUND LEVEL, NO CINDER BLOCKS ALLOWED.

WE HAVE ADDITIONAL RULES ABOUT HOW EACH SITE IS TO LOOK AND WHAT WE WILL AND WON'T ALLOW TO HAPPEN AT OUR PARK, SUCH AS PAGE ONE OF OUR RULES AND REGS UNDER GENERAL PARK RULES.

NUMBER THREE, STATES, NO MAIL OR PACKAGES SHALL BE, SHALL BE DELIVERED TO THE PARK FOR GUESTS OR VISITORS.

PAGE NUMBER TWO, UNDER SITES NUMBER ONE C PROHIBITS CLOTHESLINES.

DON'T HANG YOUR LAUNDRY, CLOTHING AND ET CETERA OUTSIDE OF YOUR RV.

PAGE NUMBER THREE, UNDER RVS AND VEHICLES.

NUMBER TWO, ADDRESSES.

PARKING.

GUESTS ARE LIMITED TO TWO VEHICLES AT NO ADDITIONAL CHARGE.

ALL VEHICLES SHALL FIT ON SITE ON THE SITE'S GRAVEL PAD, PARKING ON THE GRASS, ROADWAY OR OTHER SITE IS PROHIBITED.

IF ADDITIONAL PARKING IS DESIRED, PLEASE MAKE ARRANGEMENTS WITH A PARK AND THESE VEHICLES MUST ALSO BE IN GOOD OPERATIONAL CONDITION.

WE HOPE YOU'RE SEEING A THEME AND GETTING A VISION FOR WHAT OUR RV PARK WILL LOOK LIKE, CLEAN AND NEAT.

AND SOMEWHERE YOU AND YOUR FAMILY WOULD LIKE TO VISIT.

AND DEFINITELY SOMEWHERE WE WILL WANT TO LIVE BECAUSE THIS WILL BE OUR HOME RULES AND REGS.

PAGE TWO.

UNDER SITES NUMBER TWO SAYS, PERMANENT STRUCTURE SHALL NOT BE CONSTRUCTED ON INDIVIDUAL SITES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO DECKS, PORCHES, SHEDS, ET CETERA.

RV LIVING IS A MINIMALIST LIFESTYLE.

IT'S NOT FOR EVERYONE.

THOSE THAT FEEL THE NEED TO BRING EVERYTHING WITH THEM OR LOVE TO SHOP AND OUTGROW THEIR SITES WILL BE ASKED TO LEAVE.

THIS IS WHAT WE WANT ON OUR CAMPGROUND TO LOOK LIKE.

WHETHER YOU ARE THERE FOR A NIGHT, A WEEKEND, 30 NIGHTS OR SEVERAL MONTHS, WE'LL HAVE AN OFFICE AND PAVILION THAT WILL HOUSE A LAUNDRY FACILITY.

THERE WILL BE HANDICAPPED ACCESSIBLE SITES THAT ARE LARGER THAN OTHERS, EVEN THOUGH THIS IS NOT A FEDERAL OR STATE REQUIREMENT AT THIS TIME.

AS MENTIONED BEFORE, WE'LL HAVE RV STORAGE ON SITE.

WE HAVE SECURITY GATE, THE GUESTS AND VISITORS MUST GO THROUGH.

AND WE'LL BE GOING AROUND TO EACH SITE DAILY FOR TRASH PICKUP.

AND THIS WILL ALLOW US TO KEEP AN EYE ON EACH SITE IN THE PARK.

RULES AND REGS, PAGE ONE.

UNDER GENERAL PARK RULES NUMBER FIVE STATES THAT VISITORS ARE LIMITED TO TWO PER SITE, AND B, STATES THAT VISITORS MUST SHALL BE REGISTERED WITH THE PARK MEETING BOTH THE STATE AND LOCAL REQUIREMENTS FOR RECORD KEEPING.

WE'RE VERY CONVENIENTLY LOCATED NEAR COMPANY ONE OF THE FIRE AND EMS DEPARTMENT AND THEY, ALONG WITH THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT, WILL HAVE DIRECT ACCESS TO OUR PARK 24 7.

ALSO, HAVING HAD MY NEPHEW WORKING

[01:25:01]

FOR THE RICHMOND CITY POLICE DEPARTMENT, WE KNOW IT'S IMPORTANT FOR OFFICERS TO HAVE A SAFE PLACE TO DO THEIR REPORTS.

THEY ARE ALWAYS WELCOME AT OUR PARKS PAVILION.

OWNER OF CAMPGROUND VIEWS, MARK KEPP SAID WE COULD QUOTE HIM ABOUT OUR DESIGN AND CONCEPT.

THERE ARE NO OTHER PARKS LIKE THIS IN THE US.

THE EAST COAST IS THE PERFECT LOCATION.

THIS WILL BE ABOVE PREMIUM TO ALL CAMPGROUNDS IN THE US.

THIS PARK WILL FILL A HUGE NEED AGAIN REGARDING OUR LOCATION.

AUTO INSURANCE.ORG ENSURES FULL-TIME RVS.

THEY STATE THAT OF THE TOP 10 STATES FOR LIVING IN AN RV FULL-TIME.

VIRGINIA IS NUMBER TWO.

WE SPEND A LOT OF TIME LOOKING AT AND DRIVING TO WELL OVER 50 PROPERTIES THAT WERE A HUNDRED PLUS ACRE SITES ALL OVER THE GREATER CENTRAL VIRGINIA REGION.

NOTHING WAS BETTER SUITED FOR THIS RV PARK THAN THIS PARTICULAR SITE.

IT WAS AN EASY DECISION FOR US BECAUSE DEM WITTY MUNICIPAL CODES WERE EASILY ATTAINABLE FOR WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH.

THEN WE FOUND OUT THAT WE WERE LOCATED IN THE DENWITTY PLANNED GROWTH AREA, WHICH MEANS WE ARE EXACTLY WHAT YOU GUYS ARE LOOKING FOR FOR THIS PARCEL.

LAST WEEKEND, WE TOOK THIS PICTURE OF THE PROPERTY.

YOU CAN SEE HOW IT RISES ABOVE NASH ROAD AND HOW FULL THE TREES ARE FOR PRIVACY.

EVEN IN THE DEAD OF WINTER, YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO SEE THE RVS FROM THE STREET.

YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO HEAR THE CAMPERS.

THANKS TO THE RULES AND REGULATIONS WE HAVE IN PLACE, YOU WON'T EVEN KNOW WE'RE HERE.

WE HAVE PUT A LOT OF PRAYER AND A LOT OF TIME INTO DEVELOPING WHAT WE THINK WILL BE A WONDERFUL PLACE TO LIVE AND A FANTASTIC ADDITION TO DEN WITTY COUNTY.

WE PLACE THIS, THIS DECISION IN YOUR CAPABLE HANDS.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.

THIS IS OUR DESIRED OUTCOME AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO BECOMING A BIG PART OF DEN DENWITTY COUNTY AND AN ASSET TO THE COMMUNITY.

ONE THING THAT CAME UP MONDAY THAT WE SPOKE OF WITH MR. BRAD WAS, UM, ITEM FIVE OF THE CONDITIONS WAS ADDED THAT WE DIDN'T, WE DIDN'T KNOW WAS COMING.

AND SO WE DIDN'T REALIZE LAST MONTH WE WEREN'T GOOD AT PRESENTING.

WE WEREN'T TRYING TO MAKE A PERMANENT PARK.

EXCUSE ME.

SO WE HAVE, UH, RESEARCHED AGAIN THE OTHER PARKS THAT ARE IN OUR SAME GEOGRAPHIC TEMPERATURE, IF YOU WILL.

SO GEORGIA OVER NORTH CAROLINA, YOU KNOW, TENNESSEE, KENTUCKY, AND THEY TYPICALLY HAVE AN EIGHTH MONTH SEASONAL PACKAGE THAT THEY OFFER THEIR CAMPERS.

SO THAT WOULD BE OUR LIMIT.

WE WOULD NOT ALLOW PEOPLE TO STAY MORE THAN EIGHT MONTHS 'CAUSE THAT'S WHAT OTHER PARKS ARE DOING BECAUSE THEY'RE SEASONAL.

WE'LL STILL BE OPEN ALL YEAR ROUND, BUT IF SOMEONE STAYS AFTER EIGHT MONTHS, THEY WOULD EXCEED THAT SO THEY WOULD'VE TO STOP.

DOES THAT, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO WHAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT LAST MONTH? OKAY.

THAT'S IT.

ANY QUESTIONS? ANY QUESTIONS? OKAY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

UH, ANY COMMENTS, QUESTIONS WHILE PRESENTED WITH US? THIS IS THIS, THIS IS LIKE KIND OF A HARVEY RESORT, LIKE AN RV RESORT.

FOR, FOR ME PERSONALLY, UH, WHEN I WENT INTO THE, UH, HEARING THE CASE LAST WEEK, I, I WAS THINKING OF LIKE AN RV CAMPGROUND.

ALLOW ANY DECKS IF THAT HELPS, BUT, UH, I IT'S, I SEE IT'S ON, ON THE SITES NUMBER TWO.

AND A CAMPGROUND.

IT USUALLY, THE IMAGE THAT I HAD WAS, IS WASN'T MADE FOR PEOPLE STAYING MONTHS, YOU KNOW, AT A TIME.

UH, YOU COME FOR A WEEKEND VISIT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

YES SIR.

AND SO I WAS MORE CONCERNED ABOUT THE LENGTH OF TIME PEOPLE WOULD STAY.

UM, STILL AM, UH, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU SAY EIGHT MONTHS, I SAID .

UM, AGAIN, AN OPPORTUNITY TO, PRESENTS A LOT OF PROBLEMS TOO FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE.

I, I'M JUST KIND OF WONDERING, SINCE WE HAVEN'T HAD ANYTHING LIKE THIS, UH, IN DENWITTY OR IN VIRGINIA FOR THAT MATTER, UM, IF WE, UH, IT'S ALMOST LIKE A, A MOBILE HOME PARK.

YOU COULD HAVE THE SAME RULES AND REGULATIONS, BUT IT'S FOR PEOPLE WHO STAYED MORE THAN JUST FOR RECREATIONAL PURPOSES AND VISITS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

UM, I BUT GREAT PRESENTATION.

I, UH, ANSWERED A LOT OF QUESTIONS, SO THANK YOU FOR THAT.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? I, I, I GOT A QUESTION FOR MR. DRURY.

IF HE CAN, IF HE CAN, UH, ANSWER TO ME WHAT A, WHAT, WHAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED A PERMANENT DECK? WHAT, WHAT CLEARLY DEFINES A PERMANENT DECK? LIKE YOU'RE SAYING THAT YOU DON'T, YOU WON'T ALLOW THOSE, RIGHT.

WHAT, WHAT MAKES THAT PERMANENT? AND LET ME LOOK UP, CAN Y'ALL DIRECT ME TO WHERE Y'ALL GOT THIS IN YOUR RULES AND REGULATIONS? CERTAINLY, YES.

YOU GOT IT.

WELL, WE, UH, WE WON'T

[01:30:01]

YES SIR.

THAT SOUNDS RIGHT.

PERMANENT STRUCTURE SHOULD NOT BE CONSTRUCTED ON INDIVIDUAL SITES INCLUDED, BUT NOT LIMITED TO DECKS.

PORCHES.

LEGALLY, LEGALLY, IF YOU, FROM A LEGAL REAL ESTATE STANDPOINT, IT BECOMES A FIXTURE WHEN YOU FIX IT TO THE GROUND.

SO THAT WOULD MAKE IT PERMANENT.

Y'ALL ARE MORE IN TUNE WITH THESE.

BUT THAT'S JUST FROM A LEGAL PERSPECTIVE.

IF THEY CAME IN AND SAID, HEY, SOMEBODY'S PUT A DECK OUT THERE AND THEY'VE DUG HOLES IN THE GRIND, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME AND PUT THE THING OUT, LIKE, OKAY, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT FROM A LEGAL PERSPECTIVE.

UM, IF IT'S SITTING ON BLOCKS BLOCKS AND NOT REALLY ATTACHED, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME, I LEGALLY I'D HAVE MORE DIFFICULTY ENFORCING IT.

WE DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM ENFORCING IT 'CAUSE IT'S OUR BACKYARD.

SO THEY START DOING SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THEY'RE GONE.

EVERYBODY IN THERE WILL BE ON A, ON A LICENSE.

LIKE IF YOU WENT TO A BALL GAME, I THINK WE COVERED IT LAST MONTH.

IF YOU GO TO A BALL GAME AND YOU START ACTING UP, YOU GOT A TICKET TO GET INTO THE BALLGAME, SIT IN THAT SEAT.

BUT IF YOU START ACTING UP, YOU'RE GONNA YANK YOUR LICENSE.

THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE BUYING WHEN YOU BUY A TICKET.

SAME THING HERE.

IT'S JUST A BIGGER SCALE.

I'M, I'M COMFORTABLE THAT YOU COULD GO INTO COURT AND LET'S SAY I'M NOT TRYING TO GO AFTER YOU ALL THE OTHER NIGHT.

SURE, YES SIR.

BUT IF THEY CAME TO ME AND SAID IT WAS OUTTA COMPLIANCE, I, I WOULD WANNA SEE SOME PICTURES OF IT.

IF IT'S FIXED, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME, WHERE YOU GOTTA TEAR UP SOMETHING, LIKE I SAID IN THE GROUND OR SOMETHING, I'D SAY, HEY, IT'S, YOU KNOW, PROHIBITIVE.

UM, I WOULD THINK THE EIGHT MONTH AND IF IT WAS ADD MORE THAN EIGHT MONTHS, OF COURSE WE'VE GOT AN ISSUE.

SO I WOULD THINK THE EIGHT MONTH LIMITATION, I'M TYING IT IN.

I'M NOT SAYING THAT'S WHAT Y'ALL SHOULD DO, BUT YOU UNDERSTAND IT WOULD ELIMINATE THAT FIXED STRUCTURE.

IT WOULD CAUSE PEOPLE TO THINK TWICE ABOUT SPENDING THAT KIND OF MONEY.

IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S GOTTA BE GONE AFTER EIGHT MONTHS AND WE'RE NOT GONNA LET IT PUT IT UP.

START WITH, IF I'M MAKING SENSE.

BUT IT IS TIED TO THE GRIND AND PERMANENT.

SAME THING WITH YOUR HOUSE, UH, TRAILER, ANYTHING YOU SELL, IT'S, WE WANNA KNOW THAT THE TRAILERS ARE MOBILE.

TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION ABOUT A MOBILE HOME PARK, THOSE THINGS, TONGUES ARE REMOVED, YOU KNOW, WHEELS ARE TAKEN OFF, THEY'VE GOT SKIRTING ALL AROUND THEM.

THEY CAN'T BE MOVED.

YOU KNOW, IT'S THE HUD STICKER AND WE'RE BOTH REAL ESTATE AGENTS, SO WE'RE NOT GONNA ALLOW THAT.

YOU HAVE TO SKIRT IN A WINTER, BUT YOU DON'T HAVE, YOU'RE NOT TAKING THE WHEELS OFF AND YOU'RE GONNA LEAVE THE TONGUE ON AND YOU KNOW, YOU GOTTA MOVE IN EIGHT MONTHS.

SO THEY'RE NOT GONNA DO THAT.

WHEREAS A MOBILE HOME PARK, THEY DON'T DO THAT.

SOMEWHERE ALONG THE DISCUSSION, EITHER THE LAST TIME OR, OR WHAT I READ EARLIER, UM, WAS NOT ANY IMPACT.

YOU KNOW, THE SCHOOLS REQUIRE THINGS LIKE THAT.

IF SOMEBODY'S GONNA STAY THERE FOR EIGHT MONTHS AND THEY'VE GOT CHILDREN, I MEAN, THAT CREATE A WHOLE DIFFERENT ANIMAL, SIR.

WE ASK THAT SAME QUESTION.

AND BELIEVE IT OR NOT, THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WHO TAKE THIS LIFESTYLE HOMESCHOOL, UH, THEY'RE KIND OF, UM, COMM A COMMUNITY UNDER THEMSELVES.

SURE.

UM, CAMPERS, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS CAMP A LOT, BUT CAMPERS, WHEN THEY'VE BEEN THERE MORE THAN A WEEKEND, DEVELOP A STRONG BOND WITH EACH OTHER.

AND SO WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD TO HAVING SOME OF THE SAME PEOPLE COME BACK YEAR AFTER YEAR.

AND A BIG TIME DURING THE SCHOOL YEARS WHEN PEOPLE COME TO VIRGINIA IS FOURTH AND FIFTH GRADE WHEN THEY'RE STUDYING, UH, AMERICAN HISTORY.

AND THEY'LL RUN OVER TO WILLIAMSBURG AND TAKE THEIR KIDS THERE ON FIELD TRIPS AND THEY LOVE THAT STUFF.

EAST TOWN AND THEN UP TO DC AND OF COURSE OUR CAPITAL AND, AND DOWN TO THE BEACH, ALL OUR AND PETERSBURG ALL THE HISTORY THERE.

SO, SO THEY, THEY LIVE IT.

THAT'S WHAT A LOT OF PARENTS ARE DOING NOW.

ESPECIALLY THE PROBLEMS WE'RE HAVING IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

SO THAT'S WHAT WE, WE ASKED, WE WENT TO AR, WHICH IS THE NATIONAL BOARD ASSOCIATION OF RV, AND WE ASKED THEM, CAN YOU TELL US A PERCENTAGE? AND THERE'S NO STUDY BEEN DONE ON IT, BUT WHAT WE UNDERSTAND AND WHAT THEY CAME BACK, I DIDN'T HAVE IT PRINTED THIS TIME, I BROUGHT IT LAST TIME.

BUT IT, IT WAS VERY STRONGLY WORDED THAT FOR THE, FOR THE VAST MAJORITY OF IT, THERE IS VERY LITTLE IMPACT ON SCHOOLS, IF ANY.

AND OF COURSE WE'RE PAYING TAXES, SO, YOU KNOW, WE ARE PAYING FOR THOSE SCHOOLS.

BUT, UH, YOU KNOW, THE BEST WE CAN DO IS JUST SAY WHAT THE TRUTH IS IS YOU'RE GETTING A LOT OF FREE MONEY THAT YOU CAN USE IN THE SCHOOLS.

IT'S GONNA HELP WITHOUT US BURDENING THE SCHOOLS.

AND I JUST THOUGHT, YES, SIR.

JUST CURIOUS, MR. DREW, UH, EIGHT MONTH THING.

JUST HIT ME.

IF SOMEBODY'S HERE FOR MORE THAN SIX MONTHS, IE HALF THE YEAR AND THEY GOT A MOTOR, WHAT AMOUNTS TO A MOTOR VEHICLE, DOES THAT MEAN IT HAS TO BE REGISTERED HERE IN THE COUNTY AND PAY TAX ON IT? I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT.

I DOUBT IT.

IF, IF I CAN JUMP IN THERE.

I, WE'VE STUDIED THE LIS, THE ALLEGED, THE, UH, THE, I UNDERSTAND.

WE PUT THAT IN THE, UH, RULES AND REGULATIONS.

AND SO, UM, CAMPGROUNDS ARE EXEMPT.

NOW, WE HAVE ALSO PUT IN OUR RULES THAT, UH, IF PEOPLE BRING DOGS, THEY DO HAVE TO GET TAGGED.

[01:35:01]

SO IF THEY'RE HERE, UH, OR IF THEY ACQUIRE DOGS WHILE THEY'RE IN OUR PARK, THEY'RE REQUIRED TO GET TAGGED BY DENWITTY.

THAT'S IN OUR RULES.

AND, AND LET ME JUMP IN TOO.

I'VE GOT A SMALL TRAVEL TRAILER AS WELL, AND IF I CAN EVER RETIRE, I'M GONNA USE IT MORE.

BUT, UM, BUT IT'S LICENSED AND TAGGED AND TAXED.

IT'S JUST LIKE A CAR.

AND SO I'M TAXED ON IT IN SURREY COUNTY.

IF I GO UP TO MAINE OF FLORIDA SOMEWHERE AND STAY FOR SIX MONTHS OR SOMETHING, THE TAX IS GONNA GO BACK TO, UH, SURY COUNTY.

BUT I SEE A DIFFERENCE HERE THOUGH, WITH THIS.

WHAT I, THE PHILOSOPHY I'M HEARING IS THIS IS SOMEBODY THAT'S NOT GONNA HAVE A HOME BASE IN SURY COUNTY OR ANY OTHER COUNTY.

IT'S GONNA BE SOMEBODY THAT'S GONNA BE HERE.

YOU, YOU GONNA LICENSE IT, YOU GONNA LICENSE IT SOME WAY IN SOME LOCALITY.

THEY, MARIO IS NOT, AND, AND, AND RODDY TO GET DOWN IN, BECAUSE WE DO HAVE SOME TAXATION ISSUES WITH THIS.

IF IT'S THE VIRGINIA CODE SAYS BASICALLY IF YOU ARE TAXED IN ANOTHER LOCALITY AND THEY CAN VERIFY IT.

IT'S PRETTY DIFFICULT RIGHT.

FOR US TO DO THAT.

SO, SO ANYWAY, A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE ADOPTING THIS LIFESTYLE AND AGAIN, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO BUY IT IF THEY BUY IT IN NORTH CAROLINA.

YOU KNOW, AND THERE'S SOME ADVANTAGES OF THE STATE YOU BUY THESE THINGS FROM AND THEY'RE PROBABLY GONNA LICENSE IT AND FIGURE A WAY TO LICENSE IT IN A FAVORABLE LOCALITY.

AND THAT'S WHERE THOSE TAXES ARE GOING TO STAY.

PRETTY MUCH.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? GOT A QUESTION? YES, SIR.

CAN YOU LEGALLY, UH, PUT A PROVISION IN THERE THAT NO ONE STAYING IN THE CAMPGROUND CAN SEND A CHILD TO SCHOOL IN DENWOODY COUNTY? AS LONG AS WE DON'T HAVE TO PAY TAXES.

I'M GOOD WITH THAT.

? I DON'T THINK SO.

I WOULD LOVE THAT ACTUALLY, , BECAUSE THAT WOULD SAVE US A LOT OF MONEY IN TAXES.

AND LET ME, I PROBABLY SHOULDN'T BREAK IN TO SAY THIS EITHER.

WE, WE HAVE A EXTRA HOME.

IT'S NOT A RV, IT DOESN'T HAVE WHEELS ON IT ON OUR FARM THAT WE RENT OUT.

WE HAVE FAMILIES THAT COME THERE WITH KIDS DURING THE SCHOOL YEAR.

EVERY ONE OF 'EM HAVE BEEN HOMESCHOOLED AND THEY ARE COMING HERE SPECIFICALLY TO TAKE THEIR KIDS TO THE HISTORICAL SITES.

AND THEY DO STAY SOMETIME.

WE DON'T HAVE A TIME, LEMME TELL YOU IT'S A HOUSE.

BUT WE DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME SHORT TERM RENTALS? EVERYBODY'S HOMESCHOOLING THAT DOES THIS.

BUT IT THAT COMES TO OUR FARM.

ANYWAY, THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I ASKED THE QUESTION ABOUT, UH, RV, UM, NOT PARK, BUT UM, INSTEAD OF A CAMPGROUND.

A RESORT RESORT.

THAT'S WHY I ASKED THE QUESTION ABOUT RESORT.

'CAUSE I I DO KNOW I DID SOME RESEARCH AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE FAIRLY COMMON.

I, 'CAUSE WHEN YOU FIRST, WHEN IT FIRST CAME, I WAS LIKE, YOU, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT CAMPGROUND.

UH, I'M THINKING THE SAME THING.

YOU ALL WEEKEND CAMPERS, BUT YOU START TALKING MONTHS.

AND I USED TO CAMP WHEN I WAS YOUNGER AND DIDN'T HAVE ARTHRITIS.

THAT'S WHY I GOT IT.

BUT, UH, BABCOCK STATE PARK, JANU JANUARY 5TH WEEKEND IN JANUARY ALWAYS HAD SEVEN TO 12 INCHES OF SNOW ON THE GROUND LATE AT NIGHT.

MM.

AND WE USED TO SLEEP IN TENTS ON THE GROUND.

UM, THAT'S A CAMPGROUND.

THAT'S A CAMPGROUND.

BATH BATHROOM FACILITIES.

THAT'S ALSO, YOU JUST TALK ABOUT RV CAMPGROUND THINKING WEEKEND WEEKEND WARRIORS.

ALL OF OUR UNITS, UH, ARE REQUIRED, ALL OF THE UNITS TO COME AND VISIT US ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE FACILITIES IN THE, IN THE UNITS THEMSELVES.

THINK IT'S, I THINK IT'S UH, NUMBER SEVEN.

THAT'S THE STATE LAW.

AS I WAS READING THROUGH THE, YOUR PRESENTATION THAT WAS ON PAPER, I SAW THAT, EXCEPT FOR THE REVISIONS THAT YOU, YOU AND BRAD TALKED ABOUT THAT I DON'T HAVE IN FRONT OF ME.

I HAVE NO QUESTIONS, SIR.

MR. , YOU GOT ANYTHING? I, I, I GOT A QUESTION TO YOU JUST, JUST TO, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S REALLY FOR THE APPLICANT OR MAYBE IT'S A LEGAL QUESTION.

UH, BUT YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE'S, UH, RIGHT AROUND THAT AREA.

THERE'S, AND, AND I'M BEING RIGHT UP FRONT WHERE THERE'S FAMILY LAND THERE AND I LIVE NOT TOO FAR FROM IT.

AND MY, MY REALLY CONCERN IS WITH 300 SITES, THAT MEANS THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE DRAWING FROM YOUR AQUIFER SYSTEM.

AND I KNOW THAT YOU PUT SOMETHING IN HERE, UM, I

[01:40:01]

NUMBER SEVEN.

YES SIR.

AND THERE'S, UH, WITH DRAWING FROM THE AFER SYSTEM, THAT'S ONE THING.

HOW DO YOU, MR. DREW, HOW IF SAY FOR INSTANCE, TWO OR THREE WELLS GO DRY THERE? AND I'M JUST, THIS IS JUST ME ASKING, UH, NOT SAYING IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, BUT HOW, HOW, HOW DO YOU SAY THAT MY WELL WENT DRY BECAUSE IT JUST WENT DRY? OR WAS IT WELL, BASED ON 300 OTHER, AND I'M JUST GONNA USE IT FOR LACK OF NUMBERS, 300 OTHER WELLS PULLING OUT FOR 300 OTHER PE YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? HOW DO YOU, HOW DO YOU DO THAT? I, I I MEAN, UH, AND THE OTHER THING IS, YOU KNOW, WATER'S ONE THING, BUT SEWAGE IS ANOTHER.

AND I KNOW THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO HOOK UP TO IT AT THIS POINT, BUT IF IT, IF IT'S EVER AVAILABLE THROUGH THE COUNTY, THEN YOU HAVE TO HOOK UP TO THE WATER AND SEW IT THROUGH THE COUNTY.

BUT WHAT, WHAT DO YOU, WHAT DO YOU DO WITH 300 SITES WORTH OF SEWAGE? I MEAN, IS IT, I MEAN, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW.

I I COULD ADDRESS THAT IF YOU'D LIKE.

LAST MONTH WE TALKED ABOUT IT.

DR.

GREG MONET IS GONNA COME IN AND SET UP OUR SEPTIC SYSTEM FOR US.

SO FIRST THING HE HAS TO DO IS CHECK TO SEE FOR THE PERING.

AND THEN WE'RE GONNA EITHER USE A DD HQ, DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL, D WHATEVER.

IT'S YEAH.

THE FEDERAL, OR WE'RE GONNA USE THE, UH, STATE, STATE WOULD BE MORE OF A, UH, A DRAIN FIELD SYSTEM.

THE D THE OTHER ONE, UH, WOULD BE MORE OF A SPRINKLER SYSTEM.

SPRINKLER.

SO EVERYTHING THAT COMES OUT WOULD ALREADY BE, AND OF COURSE THAT WOULD BE ADDED BACK TO THE AQUIFER E EITHER WAY, IT'S GONNA BE ADDED BACK TO THE AQUIFER.

NUMBER TWO, UH, TO ADDRESS THE WATER ISSUE.

SECOND, UM, THE ENGINEER, I CALLED HIM AND I TALKED TO HIM, UM, FOR ITEM SEVEN THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

AND HE IS REQUIRED, WE HAVE A GOOD RELATIONSHIP WITH OUR NEIGHBORS.

UH, WE'VE ALREADY ESTABLISHED THAT.

AND SO HE HAS MADE SURE WE DID, BECAUSE HE HAS TO GO SIT ON THEIR LAND AND PUT A, A, UH, A TEST KIT DOWN INTO IT BASICALLY TO SEE, HE WANTS TO SEE WHAT KIND OF A DRAW WE HAVE TO, WE HAVE TO DRILL A WELL, HE REQUIRED TO DRILL THE WELL AND THEN TURN IT ON.

WE HAVE TO GET A GENERATOR, TURN IT ON, AND WE HAVE TO DRAW THE WATER.

AND WE HAVE TO SEE IF THEIR WELLS GO DOWN.

NOW HE TOLD ME HE'S KIND OF WASTED TIME TO DO IT BECAUSE THE WELLS ARE SO FAR AWAY.

BUT HE SAID, IF THAT'S WHAT THE COUNTY REQUIRES, HE'LL BE GLAD TO COME DO IT FOR ME.

AND BASICALLY HE HAS TO SIT OUT HERE AND WATCH 'EM.

SO THAT'S, THAT'S HOW THE PROCESS WORKS.

AND SO HE CALLED IT A DOME.

SO WE'RE GONNA BE SITTING OVER HERE AND HE WANTS TO MAKE SURE THAT THESE ONES DON'T DROP WHEN WE'RE PUMPING OUT, YOU KNOW, THE MASS AMOUNT THAT WE COULD PULL.

AND HE MAXES IT OUT.

SO THAT'S, TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION ABOUT THE WATER AND THE SEWER.

I, I WANT TO, I TO CLARIFY, UM, SO FOR THE WATER, YOU, IT'S NOT SAID HERE, IT JUST SAYS EXISTING WELLS.

BUT YOU SAID YOU MENTIONED YOUR NEIGHBORS, BUT HEY, I COULD LOSE WATER MY WELL AND BLAME IT ON YOU.

YOU COULD, YEAH.

BUT I'M 30, PROBABLY 25 MILES FROM YOU.

AND SO MY POINT IS, I MEAN, I WOULD SAY THAT I WOULD SAY THE GEOLOGY OF THE AREA WOULD DICTATE THE, THE RADIUS OF AROUND YOUR PROPERTY.

I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT WOULD BE SIMPLY THE NEIGHBOR PROPERTY.

IT COULD BE MR. CUNNINGHAM'S PROPERTY WHO'S NOT AN ADJACENT NEIGHBOR.

IT COULD BE SOMEBODY EVEN CLOSER TO THE VILLAGE.

ALL OF US ARE ON A WELL THOUGH.

I UNDERSTAND THAT.

MY POINT THOUGH, IS THAT THAT, UM, 300 WELLS, RIGHT? NO SIR.

TWO WELLS.

I'M SORRY, I MISUNDERSTOOD.

BUT EITHER WAY, 200, UH, ENOUGH WATER FOR 300 SITES BEING DRAWN, COULD THAT DOME, I'M JUST SMART ENOUGH TO BE DANGEROUS HERE.

BUT THAT, I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT DOME EXTENDS TO.

IN OTHER WORDS, DOES IT EXTEND, AND IT DEPENDS ON THE SOIL CONDITIONS AND EVERYTHING ELSE.

SO DOES THAT DOME EXTEND A MILE AWAY? TWO MILES AWAY? HALF A MILE? I DON'T KNOW.

THAT'S WHY WE'RE PAYING THE, UH, GEOLOGIST TO COME OUT AND TAKE TEST .

IT'S ABOVE OUR PAY GRADES.

I, I DON'T KNOW.

I'M GONNA DO THE BEST I CAN TO KEEP THAT FROM HAPPENING.

'CAUSE IF YOU'RE RUNNING DRY, I'M RUNNING DRY.

WELL, LIKE I SAID THOUGH, BUT I MEAN, IF, UH, I, I, I USE MYSELF AS A CLEARLY AS AN EXAGGERATION 'CAUSE I'M SO FAR AWAY.

BUT IF SOMEBODY WERE TO CLAIM THAT, I MEAN, HOW DO YOU, HOW DO YOU NOT, HOW DO YOU ADDRESS THAT? AND THEN AS FAR AS THE SEWAGE IS CONCERNED, MY QUESTION THERE WAS, UM, YOU'RE NOT GONNA HAVE 300 DRAIN FIELDS OR 300 MORE THAN LIKELY.

JUST ONE.

AND THAT'S WHY WE ASKED FOR THE, UH, SO ALL OF 'EM ARE COLLECTED TOGETHER.

WE'RE GONNA HAVE LIFT STATIONS.

SO IF IT EVER HAD THE COUNTY, YOU COULD JUST HAVE ONE PIPE ALREADY THERE TO HOOK INTO THE COUNTY.

WATER AS WELL.

WE'LL HAVE, WE'LL HAVE TWO WELLS, BUT THEY'LL BE REDUNDANT OVERLAYING TWO, TWO WELLS.

TO GO DOWN, THAT KIND OF THING.

THAT'S THE GOAL.

WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE.

I, I GUESS THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION, I, A LITTLE BIT OF EXPERIENCE WITH THAT WHEN I WAS AT THE UNIVERSITY, THE, UH, IN OUR AG ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT AND CIVIL ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT YEAH.

PEOPLE WHO SPECIALIZE IN, IN HYDROLOGY AND OLOGY AND ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF.

UH, THIS IS ALL, ALL THEY DID.

AND SO IT'S NOT THAT COMPLICATED FOR THEM TO DETERMINE WHAT'S CAUSING THE WELLS

[01:45:01]

IF IT WAS A, A BIG CONCERN IN THIS AREA.

HOW MANY WELLS DOES MCKINNEY HAVE? PROBABLY VERY FEW NOW.

WELL, OH, YOU MEAN THE TOWN OF TWO TOWN MCKINNEY? TWO.

TWO.

SEE, AND THERE'S ANY WHO, HOW MANY PEOPLE LIVING RIGHT NEXT TO THOSE WELLS THERE ANY NAME I EVER LOST WATER BECAUSE OF THE TOWN OF MCKINNEY'S WELLS? WELL, NOBODY THAT LIVES NEAR 'EM THAT I'M AWARE OF.

WELL, .

BUT I, I, I UNDERSTAND.

BUT YOU SEE WHAT I'M SAYING? IT IS JUST, IT IS, IT, IT MAY BE FOREIGN FOR PEOPLE LIKE ME, BUT I, BUT I, I KNOW PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THE BUSINESS WHO DO THIS KIND OF CONSULTING AND ENGINEERING KIND OF THING.

THAT'S, I, I'M, I'M NOT, I'M NOT, BECAUSE I'M NOT QUESTIONING THAT.

MY POINT IS, IT JUST SAYS EXISTING WELLS.

YEAH, WELL, EXISTING WELLS.

NATALIE KNOWS TWO.

SO, BUT NO, THE EXISTING WELLS YOU'RE REFERRING TO THE NEIGHBORS, PEOPLE, THE NEIGHBOR.

SO, SO WHAT NEIGHBORS, IS IT NEIGHBORS? IS IT THE ENTIRE COUNTY? THE ENTIRE PLANET.

YOU, YOU SEE WHAT I'M SAYING? HOW DO YOU DEFINE THAT? NUMBER SEVEN.

WELL, I'S READING, I SAY, I THINK THE, THE CONSULTING ENGINEERS HAVE THOSE STANDARDS OF PROTOCOL OF WHAT THEY DO BASED ON SOIL TYPES, ET CETERA, ET CETERA.

AND SO THEY WOULD KNOW, THEY HAD THE BEST IDEA OF KNOWING HOW FAR AWAY THEY NEED TO GO BASED ON THE SOIL TYPE AND THAT KIND OF THING.

IT, IT'S MORE OF AN ART THAN THE SCIENCE, I THINK.

BUT THAT'S FINE.

WELL, YOU KNOW, IT MAY BE FOR SOME OF US, IT, UH, UM, WELL, I DID HAVE SOME COMMENTS WITH YOU ALL, BUT I DIDN'T WANT TO TAKE THESE GUYS' TIME.

UH, ANY MORE COMMENTS FOR OUR PRESENTERS BEFORE WE OPEN IT UP FOR, UH, PUBLIC HEARING? PUBLIC HEARING? THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

EXCELLENT.

PRESIDENT.

WE HAD PUBLIC HEARING, MR. CHAIR.

I DON'T OH, WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A PUBLIC HEARING.

'CAUSE IF YOU, WE DIDN'T CONTINUE IT.

WE CLOSED IT DOWN LAST TIME.

THERE'S NO ONE SIGNED UP.

ANY NUMBERS? NO.

OKAY, THEN THIS, WE DON'T OPEN IT UP THEN.

COMMISSIONERS, WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE? WELL, SO I, I WANT, I'D LIKE TO START BY, I, I'VE THOUGHT ABOUT THIS A LOT OVER THE PAST MONTH AND LOOKED AT THE, UH, LOOKED AT THE LAND USE MAPS.

UM, I DON'T, I DON'T SEE THIS AS AN RV PARK.

I SEE THIS AS MORE OF A SUBDIVISION OR A MOBILE HOME PARK.

UM, I MEAN, I, I DON'T, I REALIZE THAT'S NOT WHAT IT'S STATED AS.

BUT WE TALKED ABOUT IT LAST MONTH.

WE HAD FOUR EXISTING RV PARKS.

I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW ABOUT ONE OF 'EM, BUT I KNEW OF THE OTHER THREE.

AND THEY WERE, ALL FOUR WERE ESTABLISHED IN THE 1980S.

AND THAT, THAT WAS KIND OF FASCINATING HISTORY TO ME.

BUT ANYWAY, THE POINT IS, AND THEN WHEN, IT WAS KIND OF SHOCKING WHEN THE APPLICANT SAID HE WAS LOOKING AT ALL HIS LONG TERM, BECAUSE MY OWN BIAS WAS, I JUST THOUGHT ABOUT, YOU KNOW, I MIGHT RETIRE AND BUY A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS VEHICLE AND JUST TOOL AROUND FOR A WEEKEND SOMEWHERE AND BRING IT HOME.

AND THEN A MONTH LATER I GO SOMEWHERE ELSE.

BUT AFTER THE VISION HAS BEEN DESCRIBED HERE, I SEE IT MORE LONG TERM.

SO HENCE IT'S MORE LIKE A MOBILE HOME PARK OR A SUBDIVISION.

AND THEN WHEN YOU COMBINE THAT WITH THE FACT THAT IT IS IN OUR GROWTH AREA, AND THERE'S ONLY JUST A HANDFUL OF PARCELS, AND I'M JUST EYEBALLING IF THAT'S 186 ACRES, THE OTHER IS PROBABLY THE INFIELD AREA BETWEEN THE OTHER HOMES ON WILKINSON ROAD AND, AND, UH, COURTHOUSE ROAD AND RIGHT ONE ARE ALL PROBABLY ANOTHER COUPLE HUNDRED ACRES.

I MEAN, IT'S, YOU'RE KIND OF, YOU'RE KIND OF FILLING IN THE INFIELD WITH IT.

OR YOU'RE, YOU'RE, YOU'RE ESTABLISHING AN OUTER BOUNDARY ALONG THE CREEK AND YOU'LL HAVE AN INFIELD LATER TO FILL IN WITH SUBDIVISION OR WHATEVER, OR EXPANSION OF THIS.

SO, UM, JUST LIKE ANY SUBDIVISION OR EVEN THE APARTMENT COMPLEX THAT WAS APPROVED A FEW MONTHS AGO, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN DOWN THE ROAD.

I MEAN, WE HEARD, JUST USE THE CO APARTMENT COMPLEX AS AN EXAMPLE.

YOU KNOW, WE HEARD THAT APPLICANT TALK ABOUT HOW HE WAS GONNA HAVE A GREAT PLAN AND ALL THIS, AND YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN 50 YEARS FROM NOW.

NONE OF US DO.

IT'S NO DIFFERENT THAN ANY OTHER SUBDIVISION OR THESE GUYS.

THESE GUYS ARE GONNA BE HERE.

JUST DON'T KNOW.

SO, I MEAN, I THINK YOU HAVE TO JUST KIND OF GO ON FAITH A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT.

SO I DON'T SEE THIS AN RV PARK ANYMORE.

'CAUSE MY, MY DEFINITION OF AN RV PARK IS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

I NOW SEE THIS MORE AS A, AT LEAST SEMI-PERMANENT SUBDIVISION OF MOBILE HOME PARK.

AND THAT'S THE QUESTION TO ME IS WHETHER THAT'S APPROPRIATE IN THIS GROWTH AREA OR NOT.

THAT'S HOW I'M LOOKING AT IT.

WE JUST DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO COMPARE IT TO.

WE HAVE MOBILE HOME PARKS, AND I AGREE THOSE, UH, STANDARDS FROM MOBILE HOME PARK WOULDN'T BE APPROPRIATE FOR THIS PARTICULAR THING.

BUT I DON'T THINK OUR CAMPING SITES ARE APPROPRIATE FOR THIS KIND OF THING EITHER BECAUSE, PRIMARILY BECAUSE OF THE LENGTH OF STAY.

AND I UNDERSTAND THAT'S YOUR BUSINESS MODEL.

UH, IF WHAT I WANTED TO HEAR WAS THAT WE WOULD RESTRICT OUR, UH, GUESTS, YOU KNOW, TO 30, 30

[01:50:01]

DAYS PER YEAR.

UH, BUT NO MORE THAN THAT.

UH, SO IF THEY WANT TO COME AND STAY FOR 30 DAYS, FINE.

IF THEY WANT TO, YOU KNOW, COME A WEEK HERE AND A WEEK THERE AND A WEEK LATER, YOU KNOW, FINE.

UH, BUT THE IDEA OF EVEN FOR EIGHT, EIGHT MONTHS, I JUST FIND THAT TO BE ALMOST A, ANOTHER, UH, COMMUNITY.

COMPLETELY.

AND, UH, I, I WISH WE HAD A BETTER TIME.

I THINK A BETTER TERM.

TUCK WAS TALKING ABOUT A RV RESORT.

WELL, YOU KNOW, THAT SOUNDS BETTER THAN THE RV PARK.

UM, I, I JUST HAVE A HARD TIME WITH THE, THE LENGTH OF STAY.

UM, WELL, THAT'S WHY I THINK IT'S MORE OF A, LIKE I SAID, IT'S, IT'S MORE AKIN TO A SUBDIVISION OR A MM-HMM .

OR A MOBILE HOME CAR.

CAN, CAN I ASK A QUESTION? YES, SIR.

UM, CAN I ASK WHAT YOUR CONCERNS ARE FOR THE LENGTH OF TIME? IS IT TRAFFIC ON NASH ROAD OR IS IT THE USE OF THE WATER? 'CAUSE WE'RE GONNA USE A WHOLE LOT LESS WATER FOR 300 SITES, UH, THAN A, A NEIGHBORHOOD WOULD.

UH, IF WE WERE TO PUT 300 HOUSES IN THERE, UH, THE NATIONAL STANDARDS, 250 GALLONS PER DAY.

UH, 400 WASTE, WHICH DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO ME.

BUT ANYWAY, WE'RE GONNA BE AT, UH, A HUNDRED MAX PER CAMPSITE.

'CAUSE WE USE A LOT LESS WATER.

WE'RE, WE'RE IN CAMPERS.

WELL, MY, MY PROBLEM IS THAT WE, WHEN WE CALL IT AN RV CAMPGROUND, I DON'T CONSIDER THIS TO BE A CAMPGROUND.

I CONSIDER THIS TO BE A COMMUNITY FOR RVS.

BUT IF WE SWITCH IT TO THE WEEKENDERS, NOW YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TRAFFIC ISSUES.

'CAUSE YOU'RE GONNA BE TRYING TO PUT IN 600 PEOPLE IN AND OUT BIG RIGS UP AND DOWN NASH ROAD, JUST BEATING IT TO DEATH.

WHEREAS OUR WAY, A LOT OF PEOPLE, 23% OVER 20, 23% WORK FROM HOME.

YOU KNOW, THEY DON'T SEND THEIR KIDS TO SCHOOL.

YOU'RE STILL GETTING THE TAXES.

WE'RE NOT BEATING UP THE HIGHWAY.

BUT IF YOU WANT US TO, WE CAN SWITCH IT UP.

BUT THEN YOU'RE GONNA BE FUSSING AT ME FOR THE BIG RIGS RUNNING UP AND DOWN.

WELL, THAT'D BE, VDOT WILL HAVE TO KIND OF MAKE THAT DETERMINATION.

BUT YOU WOULDN'T LIKE THAT.

I MEAN, IF YOU LIVE ON NASH ROAD, YOU KNOW, YOU WOULDN'T WANNA SEE THAT.

WHAT, WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THE TRAFFIC WILL GO WEST ON NASH ROAD? THAT GOTTA BE 99% OF THE PRODUCT COME FROM ROUTE ONE.

THAT WAS MENTIONED BY MR. BRAD.

SO, BUT I JUST, I WAS WONDERING IF YOU COULD FILL ME IN ON WHAT IT IS THAT WE CAN EXPLAIN THAT WOULD HELP YOU UNDERSTAND THIS ISN'T A NEIGHBORHOOD, THIS IS, WE'RE USING FAR LESS OF THE RESOURCES, BUT IT, BUT IT'S, IT'S STILL ANOTHER COMMUNITY.

I MEAN, 300 SITES.

UM, YOU WON'T, YOU WON'T EVEN KNOW WE'RE THERE.

HONESTLY.

THAT'S THE INTERESTING THING ABOUT IT.

BUT IF WE START GOING TO SHORT TERM, YOU KNOW MM-HMM .

PEOPLE WHO LIVE ON NASH ROAD ARE GONNA BE KIND OF FRUSTRATED.

THAT'S OUR CONCERN.

AND IT'S NOT THE, LIKE YOU SAID, IT'S NOT THE BUSINESS MODEL.

WE'RE TRYING TO MEET A NEED IN AMERICA, NOT CREATE GOTCHA.

WE DON'T WANT A FIFTH CAMPGROUND IN DENWITTY.

WELL, ME EITHER.

NOT, NOT IF THEY LIKE THE ONES THAT I'M FAMILIAR WITH.

I KNOW WHEN I, I'VE TRAVELED 1 53, BUT AMELIA COUNTY, UH, RIGHT BEFORE YOU GET TO 360, AND I'LL BET THOSE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN THERE FOR 20 YEARS.

I MEAN, THEY, ON WEEKENDS, DURING SUMMER, THEY'RE PACKED WITH TWO DAY A WEEKENDERS, THINGS LIKE THAT.

BUT YOU GO BY THERE NOW, A COUPLE HUNDRED MOBILE HOMES LIKE THAT.

NOT MOBILE HOMES, BUT RVS.

AND THAT'S NOT WHAT I WOULD WANT TO SEE IF I COULD HELP IT.

I, I'LL SAY THAT I THOUGHT ABOUT THIS FROM A TRAFFIC GENERATION STANDPOINT.

AGAIN, IT'S JUST LIKE A COMMUNITY.

UM, I THINK EITHER WAY YOU'RE GENERATING A LOT OF TRAFFIC BETWEEN THE ENTRANCE POINT HERE AND PRESUMABLY BACK TO, UH, R ONE.

I, I WOULD SAY IF YOU DID A TRAFFIC STUDY, I WOULD, I WOULD BE HARD PRESSED TO THINK IT'S PROBABLY LIKE 95 5, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

YOU KNOW, 5% MIGHT BE GOING WEST.

THE OTHER 95% ARE GOING TO ROUTE ONE.

SO THAT IT, DURING THAT, DURING THAT, DURING THAT OLD SEGMENT, HOWEVER LONG THAT IS, THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE GENERATING A LOT OF TRAFFIC.

'CAUSE YOU'RE GONNA HAVE PEOPLE NOT ONLY LIVING THERE AND COMMUTING OR WHATEVER THEY'RE DOING, BUT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE ALL THE DELIVERIES AND YOU KNOW, THAT KIND OF THING TO THEIR CENTRAL POINT.

JUST LIKE, YOU KNOW, JUST, I GUESS DELIVERIES, NO DELIVERIES ALLOWED.

BUT I MEAN, LIKE, HOW DOES, LIKE A, SO HOW DOES LIKE FEDEX OR UPS DELIVER? THEY DON'T, NOT TO OUR SITE.

NO, SIR.

YOU KNOW, THE AMAZON STORAGE BOXES THAT YOU CAN GET YOUR STUFF DELIVERED TO, THAT'S WHERE PEOPLE HAVE TO GO THE POST OFFICE.

FAIR ENOUGH.

LEAVING AND COMING RIGHT BACK AND FORTH.

WE TRIED TO, WE TRIED TO THINK ABOUT WHAT WE WOULD WANT IF WE WERE DEALING WITH CITIZENS, BECAUSE THAT'S GONNA BE OUR BACKYARD.

WE DON'T WANT THAT KIND OF MESS.

SO 300 TIMES, UH, NINE, IT'S 2,700, BASED ON WHAT YOU SAID, CUT IT IN HALF, YOU'RE STILL LOOKING AT PROBABLY 1300 CARS A DAY.

YOU KNOW, ADDED GOING EASTBOUND.

BUT THEY WORK, THEY WORK FROM HOME.

THAT'S THE ONLY THING.

WELL, I KNOW, I I, I'M JUST GIVING GENERAL FIGURES.

SURE.

IT'S, IT'S, IT'S LIKE WHAT HE WAS TALKING ABOUT WITH THE WELLS.

IT'S MORE OF A ART THAN A SIGN.

WELL, IF PEOPLE DON'T WORK FROM HOME THAT YOU SAID ARE, GO, GO TO FORT LEE, ARE GONNA GO TO CONSTRUCTION, A CONSTRUCTION SITE ARE GONNA GO TO ANY OTHER JOB, THOSE PEOPLE ARE GONNA BE

[01:55:01]

AND I'M KINDA WITH SAM ON THIS, IF WE THREW 350 HOMES UP RIGHT THERE, IT'D BE A LOT OF EXTRA TRAFFIC COMING IN AND OUTTA NASH ROAD BECAUSE THOSE PEOPLE WOULD BE GOING TO WORK TOO.

AND COMING HOME, GOING TO THE GROCERY STORE, COMING BACK, DOING ALL KINDS OF STUFF.

SO, I MEAN, IT'S, TRAFFIC IS AN ISSUE, BUT THERE'LL BE CAR TRAFFIC AND NOT BIG RIG TRAFFIC.

THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LONG TERM, SHORT TERM.

UH, I DON'T EVEN LOOK AT THE BIG RIG TRAFFIC.

IT'S EVEN AN ISSUE.

IT'S ALL CAR TRAFFIC IN MY OPINION.

GOTCHA.

WELL, I MEAN, I GUESS IT'S ABOUT 25 FOOT TRAFFIC.

I MEAN, WHEN THEY COME IN AND OUT, YES, IT'S GONNA BE A, A BIGGER VEHICLE.

BUT ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS, SIR? THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR.

BEEN VERY HELPFUL.

UM, OKAY.

I'LL CHAIR, WE ENTERTAIN A MOTION, UH, FOR RECOMMENDATION FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.

GENTLEMEN, WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE? I DON'T HAVE MY, I'M GETTING THERE.

I DON'T HAVE, THERE YOU GO.

I HAVE DO ONE QUESTION HERE.

'CAUSE I WAS CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SITING, UH, A MOBILE HOME PARK VERSUS AN A CAMPGROUND.

AND THINKING ABOUT ALONG THE LINES, WHAT WE'VE ALREADY SAID IS, IS IT, IS IT GONNA BE MORE OF A MOBILE MOBILE HOME THAN A A CAMPGROUND? UH, I GOT IT.

RV PARK.

UM, AND THE DETAILS Y'ALL GONE IN, YOU KNOW, MAKES ME THINK THAT IT'S NOT, IT HASN'T MOVED CLOSER TO BEING A MOBILE HOME PARK.

UH, WE, WE THINK THAT MOST PEOPLE WILL BE THERE, UH, THREE MONTHS.

THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT WE THINK THE AVERAGE WOULD BE.

UHHUH, THE VAST MAJORITY, WE'LL HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT STAY 30 DAYS, THEN THE NEXT WILL BE TWO MONTHS, AND THEN THE THREE MONTHS WILL KIND OF BE THE, THE NORMAL.

SO I DID THAT MR. HAR TO, UH, MY OWN BENEFIT TO, UH, HELP ME UNDERSTAND WHAT THE PROCEDURES WERE FOR ONE VERSUS THE OTHER.

GOTCHA, GOTCHA.

SO, SO IN THAT SPIRIT, UH, LIKE I SAID, I'VE BEEN THINKING ABOUT THIS A LOT.

IT'S KIND OF TOUGH FOR ME.

SO WHAT IS THE, UM, I GUESS STAFF LOOKING AT YOU ALL, WHAT IS THE BUFFER HERE FOR THIS COMPARED TO, I MEAN, I'M JUST LOOKING AT THE MOBILE HOME CARD.

NOT THAT I'M COMPARING, BUT I JUST HAPPEN TO SEE THOSE NUMBERS.

WHAT'S THE BUFFER HERE AROUND THE ENTIRE 186 ACRES? IS IT SIMILAR, I GUESS IS MY QUESTION? IT'S SIMILAR.

CONDITION NUMBER THREE WOULD REQUIRE A 75 FOOT BUFFER ON THE EAST EASTERN SIDE OF THE PROPERTY.

SO THAT'S ALONG, UH, 24, 26 AND 27.

CORRECT.

BY ONLY 26 AND 27.

THE OTHER SIDE'S, THE WATER.

WELL, YEAH, BUT I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW WHO OWNS 57 12, BUT IF I OWNED IT, I'D LIKE TO HAVE A BUFFER.

ALSO, BECAUSE THE WESTERN SIDE OF THE PROPERTY WAS GONNA BE USED FOR THE RECREATIONAL AREAS, UH, WHERE THE TRAILS ARE GONNA BE.

AND IS THAT COMMITTED IN THE, UH, IN THE, IN THE CONDITIONS TOO? UH, IN CONDITION, NOT SPECIFICALLY, BUT CONDITION ONE TALKS ABOUT THE PROJECT BEING DEVELOPED IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE CON CONCEPTUAL PLAN.

AND SO THE OTHER THING THAT HITS ME TOO ABOUT, LIKE I SAID, IT, IT, IT, IT, IT'S COMING IN MY MIND.

I'M HAVING A HARD TIME DISTINGUISHING IT AGAIN BETWEEN A SUBDIVISION AND A MOBILE HOME PARK.

AND I KEEP THINKING ABOUT ACCESS.

I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT THE RULES ARE ON THAT FOR LIKE, THE SIZE OF A SUBDIVISION OR SOMETHING.

THERE'S SOME KIND OF, YOU KNOW, FIRE EVENT OR WHATEVER THAT NORMALLY YOU HAVE AT LEAST TWO.

[02:00:01]

ISN'T THERE LIKE A, A SLIDING SCALE ON THAT? YOU GET TO A CERTAIN LEVEL, 59 LOTS YEAH.

IN A SUBDIVISION.

SO SIX TIMES THE NUMBER OF, OF, UH, OF LOTS PER SE.

UM, YOU KNOW, I I I JUST HATE TO SEE ONE, YOU KNOW, I HATE TO SEE SOMETHING GOING ON AT THE, UH, ENTRANCE THAT BLOCKS EVERYBODY ELSE'S ABILITY TO, TO, YOU KNOW, GET AWAY.

AGAIN.

WE, WE ASKED AT, WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE IF ANYBODY HAD ANY CONCERNS RELATED TO THAT.

AND WE DID NOT RECEIVE ANY NO, I COMMENTS, I UNDERSTAND.

CONCERNED ABOUT THE ENTRANCE.

I'M JUST THINKING THAT'S A LOT OF FOLKS IN THERE.

I DON ONLY HAVE ONE WAY OUT THAT, THAT, THAT'S MY ONLY CONCERN.

IF IT HELPS, THERE'LL BE DUAL ENTRANCES THERE SO WE COULD OPEN BOTH GATES.

AND SO IF ONE WAS BLOCKED, THE OTHER WOULD BE OPEN.

VICE VERSA.

HOW FAR APART? WE'RE ALSO GONNA HAVE HEAVY EQUIPMENT.

HOW FAR APART GONNA BE SIDE SIDE? SO THAT'S, YEAH, SO, SO YOU'RE GONNA HAVE A ABOUT OF 40 FEET, YOU KNOW, IT'D BE HARD TO BLOCK THE WHOLE THING.

AND THEN WE'RE GONNA HAVE HEAVY EQUIPMENT THERE BECAUSE WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO DO GROUNDWORK MAINTENANCE.

SO WHEN YOU SAY 40 FEET, YOU MEAN LIKE SLIGHTLY WIDER THAN A STANDARD V ON COMMERCIAL ENTRANCE, WHICH IS 30 FEET.

BECAUSE WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, THE GATES, WE HAVE TO PROTECT IT.

I, I, I MEAN I COULD SEE A, I COULD SEE A F-150 LIGHTNING CATCH ON FIRE THERE AND IT'D BE BURNING FOR THE HOURS AND DAYS.

HMM.

A WHO, A LITHIUM BATTERY IN A MOTOR.

NEW MOTOR VEHICLES, YOU CAN'T PUT 'EM OUT.

THAT'S RIGHT.

THEY BURN OUT.

THEY HAVE TO BURN OUT.

IT IS TOXIC FUSE.

AND YEAH, I, I MEAN, I'M JUST USING THAT AS AN EXAMPLE.

YOU SAID F-150, THAT'S WHAT'S CALLED ATTENTION.

THE, THE LIGHTNING VERSION.

BUT I, I, THAT'S WHAT WE DRIVE, RIGHT? I, I MEAN, I'M LOOKING AT IT, MY VIEWPOINT ON THIS IS IT'S, UH, IT'S UH, I'LL SAY SEMI-PERMANENT BECAUSE OF WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT EIGHT MONTHS.

BUT IT'S STILL A AT, I DO CONCEDE THAT, UH, IT IS PART OF OUR GROWTH AREA, BUT WHEN I THINK ABOUT IT AS A SUBDIVISION OR A MOBILE HOME PARK, I WOULD THINK, YOU KNOW, EGRESS AND THE BUFFER COMES TO MIND.

THE INGRESS, EGRESS TO THE COMMUNITY COMES TO MIND.

WE DO HAVE A BUFFER ON THE NORTH EDGE TOO.

I'M NOT SURE WHAT PARCEL NUMBERS ABOVE THERE, BUT THAT IS ALSO THE 75 FOOT.

UH, STAFF IDENTIFIED, UM, PARCELS 26 AND 27, WHICH IS ALONG YOUR NORTH, NORTHEAST, AND EAST BORDER.

BUT, UM, THE ONE THAT REALLY STICKS OUT TO ME ALONG THE CREEK IS IDENTIFIED AS 57 12, AND THERE'S NO BUFFER THERE.

AND I DO UNDERSTAND THAT'S, THAT'S DOWN IN THE LOW AREA, BUT THAT'S ALL RECREATION.

UH, MR. BASSETT IS, UM, HA HAVE, I GUESS ALL THE SURROUNDING LANDOWNERS WERE NOTIFIED.

MR. CHAIR.

NOW WE ACTUALLY VISITED ALL OF THEM.

THEY MANY DO US LIKE THEY DID THE LAST TIME.

THEY DON'T SHOW UP HERE.

PEDESTRIAN REWARD, SO, WELL, NO ONE HAD SHOWED UP TONIGHT, OBVIOUSLY, OR LAST MONTH EITHER.

WELL, ACTUALLY MR. CHAMBER CAME LAST MONTH.

UM, BUT, UM, ANY OTHER COMMENTS THAT YOU GOT FROM THESE GUYS? WELL, UM, NO.

I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY THE SELLERS WOULD LIKE US TO BUY IT BECAUSE THEY OH, SURE, SURE.

I UNDERSTAND.

THEY'D LOVE TO SEE US PUT SOMETHING NICE THERE.

SURE.

THAT'S WHY WE TOOK THE TIME TO BUILD THE EXTRA PRESENTATION TO MAKE, I MEANT, YOU KNOW, I MEANT THE FOLKS THAT WILL, YOU KNOW, BE THERE AFTER, AFTER YOU, AFTER YOU BUILT IT.

LIKE MR. CHAMBERS, HE WAS EXCITED ABOUT IT.

ARE WE GETTING THERE? YES, SIR.

I'LL READ THIS STATEMENT.

MAY NOT BE FAVORABLE, MAY NOT, MAY OR MAY NOT BE RESOLVED.

THAT IN ORDER TO ASSURE COMPLIANCE WITH VIRGINIA CODE SECTION 15.2286 A THREE AND SEVEN, IT'S ONLY GOING SECTION 22 DASH 22.

AND 22 DASH TWO IS STATED THAT THE PUBLIC PURPOSE FOR WHICH THIS RESOLUTION INITIATED IS TO FULFILL THE REQUIREMENTS OF PUBLIC NECESSITY, CONVENIENCE, GENERAL WELFARE, AND GOOD ZONING PRACTICE.

I MOVE THAT CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT REQUEST REQUEST C DASH 23 DASH THREE AS PRESENTED TO BE RECOMMENDED FOR DISAPPROVAL IN TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS THAT THE ISSUE OF CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NOT BEING COMPLIANCE WITH THE INTENT, PURPOSE, AND DESIGN OF DOING COUNTY ZONING.

QUESTIONS? UH, I MEAN, IS THERE A SECOND? I'M SORRY.

MOTION BEEN MADE FOR DISAPPROVAL TO THE BOARD.

SUPERVISORS.

ANY

[02:05:01]

MORE DISCUSSION? I'LL MOTION MADE.

AND SECOND MR. GAR.

I'M SORRY, MR. SORRY.

YOU WERE GONNA SAY SOMETHING? UM, COULD WE VOTE I GUESS MR. TUS? AYE.

PRO ? NO.

WE HAVE THREE YESES FOR DISAPPROVAL AND WE HAVE FOUR NOS.

WE HAVE THREE AND THREE.

UH, YESES FOR DISAPPROVAL AND NOS ARE DISAGREE.

THREE AND THREE TIE.

OKAY, THEN MR. DREW, WHAT THE, WHAT, WHAT DO WE DO NOW? Y'ALL ARE VOTING TOO QUICK FOR ME.

LET ME, LET ME PERUSE THE BYLAWS JUST TO, I KNOW WHAT THE ROBERTS RULES SAY, BUT LET ME MAKE SURE Y'ALL DIDN'T CHANGE 'EM.

, HAVE YOU READ THAT MARK? NO, I, I HAVEN'T.

YOU WANT ME TO GIVE YOU THE YESES AND NO AGAIN, MR. JUROR? NO.

IT'S THREE.

THREE, CORRECT? YES, SIR.

THAT'S CORRECT.

UM, YOU REALIZE THAT, THAT WHAT WE'RE DOING IS SIMPLY MAKING A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD SUPERVISORS YES, SIR.

AND THAT THEY WILL HERE THIS AGAIN, UM, SOMETIMES THEY, UH, AGREE WITH US.

SOMETIMES THEY DON'T.

UH, AND THAT'S NOTHING THAT WE CAN DO.

WE TRY TO GET THE BEST INFORMATION POSSIBLE AND MAKE WHAT WE THINK IS THE BEST FOR THE COUNTY.

UM, YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS HAVE JUST REALLY DONE A GREAT JOB OF EXPLAINING SOMETHING TO US THAT WE'VE NEVER HEARD ABOUT.

AND THAT'S, I DO.

WHAT, THAT'S PART OF THE DIFFICULTY WE ALL STRUGGLING WITH.

I THINK ALL OF US ARE STRUGGLING WITH BEING ON THE FENCE.

IT JUST WISHING WE HAD A BETTER UNDERSTANDING.

BUT WHAT YOU DID TONIGHT WAS AWESOME.

AND I THINK IF YOU DO THAT WITH BOARD SUPERVISOR, UH, THEY WILL HAVE, YOU KNOW, GAIN A GOOD APPRECIATION FOR WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO.

I APPRECIATE.

UM, BUT YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHERE WE ARE.

I DON'T SEE ANYTHING IN THE, UH, BYLAW TO ADDRESS THIS.

DON'T REMEMBER THERE.

UM, UM, I WOULD SAY THAT ROBERT'S RULES IS, IS WHEN IT'S A TIE VOTE, YOUR MOTION HAS NOT BEEN CARRIED.

WELL, EITHER WAY IT'S A RECOMMENDATION.

IT JUST KIND OF GIVES, YEAH, IT GIVES THEM THE SENSE OF OUR DISCUSSION.

SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, THEN IT'S, UH, YOU SAID WASN'T NOW THE RECOMMENDATION.

THE MOTION DID NOT CARRY.

DID NOT CARRY.

SO THEN IT WOULD DIDN'T GET CARRIED.

THEN DO WE NEED TO VOTE FOR THE NEXT ONE OR IS THAT JUST UNDERSTOOD? IT WOULDN'T BE FOR APPROVAL.

YOU KNOW, Y'ALL GONNA MAKE ME GO TO ROBERT'S RULES ON THIS ONE.

UM, IN OTHER WORDS, THE MOTION DID NOT CARRY MM-HMM .

UM, DO Y'ALL HAVE AN ALTERNATE MOTION? OR WE CAN CERTAINLY PUT IT IN THERE THAT IT WAS, UH, THAT THERE WAS NOT A RECOMMENDATION.

WELL, THEN WHY HAD THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, WHEN IT WAS A TIE FOR THE APARTMENT COMPLEX, DID THE, UH, CHAIR GET TO VOTE AGAIN? HE GOT TO PLACE ANOTHER VOTE TO BREAK THE TIE.

I, I, SOMEBODY MADE A MOTION.

I WASN'T THERE, SO I CAN'T SPEAK ON THAT.

BUT THAT'S THE REASON.

I'M JUST SAYING, YOU CERTAINLY CAN MAKE ANOTHER MOTION IF YOU SO DESIRE THIS EVENING.

SO THE MOTION DIDN'T CARRY, I GUESS IS WHAT I'M SAYING.

SO DID THE CHAIR VOTE THE FIRST TIME AROUND.

YEAH, I KNOW HE DID.

SO I'M THINKING THAT, UH, WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE HAPPEN IS THAT WE WOULD COMMUNICATE TO THE BOARD SUPERVISORS A THREE, THREE TIE.

WE UNDERSTAND WHAT ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDERS ARE.

I DON'T THINK IT'S GONNA MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE.

YOU CAN VOTE ON THE NEXT MOTION.

IT'S GONNA BE A THREE THREE TIE.

AND I WOULD SAY LEAVE IT AS A COMMUNICATE TO THEM THAT IT WAS A TIE.

AND I WOULD ASSUME THAT I'LL BE THERE TO HELP, UH, COMMUNICATE.

BUT YEAH, JUST LET ME COMMUNICATE THIS TO YOU.

DOES ANYBODY ELSE WANT TO MAKE A NEW MOTION? IT CAN BE DENIAL, IT CAN BE APPROVAL.

IT DOES NOT MATTER.

DOES ANYBODY WANT TO CHANGE THEIR MIND? NO.

THE ONLY OTHER THING I CAN THINK OF THAT YOU TELL ME IF I'M WRONG, I'M JUST THROWING THIS OUT, JUST ME THROWING STUFF OUT.

WE GOT A MEMBER ABSENT, YOU COULD WAIT A MONTH.

RIGHT? THAT'S AN OPTION TOO.

BUT I DON'T THINK IT REALLY CHANGES ANYTHING IN TERMS OF GIVING THE SENSE.

'CAUSE EVEN IF IT'S 3, 4, 4, 3 NEXT MONTH, THE SAME SENTENCE IS GONNA GO TO THE BOARD.

YOU CERTAINLY CAN, UH, SOMEBODY CAN MAKE A MOTION TO TABLE IT TO THE NEXT MEETING.

I MEAN, THAT IS

[02:10:01]

AN OPTION, RIGHT? YES.

I'M NOT RECOMMENDING IT.

I'M JUST, JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE I KNEW THAT THAT AN OPTION.

CERTAINLY THAT'S AN OPTION.

BUT I THINK THE IDEA HERE, BECAUSE WE WERE RECOMMEND RECOMMENDING TO THE BOARD THAT WE COULD RECOMMEND, UH, WITH THREE, THREE TIE.

WE, WE, WE DON'T REC WE RECOMMEND DISAPPROVAL, WHICH WAS NOT PASSED.

SO THAT'S OFF THE BOARD.

AND THREE, THREE TIE AND THEY'LL TAKE IT FROM THERE.

I I I AGREE WITH YOU'RE NOT RECOMMENDING DISCIPLINE.

WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING ANYTHING WAS NOT APPROVED.

MARCH 21ST, TUESDAY, MARCH 21ST.

WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING REALLY ANYTHING BECAUSE IT WAS A TIE.

WHAT I WOULD SAY IS I'M GONNA HAVE TO MAKE SURE AND GO BACK AND LOOK UP IN ROBERT'S RULES AND WE CERTAINLY CAN BE IN TOUCH WITH Y'ALL.

I'M SORRY, I GOT A CHARLIE HORSE IN MY LEG HERE YOU TWO TO ME.

NOW I'M NOT GONNA, I'M NOT GONNA ASK Y'ALL TO MASSAGE IT , BUT, UH, BUT ANYWAY, BUT, UM, I THINK THAT'S FINE AND I THINK IT'S LIKELY FINE THAT WE CAN PUT IN THE MINUTES SO THAT THERE WAS A VOTE AND IT WAS A TIE.

UM, SO THERE WAS NO, WITH THIS PORT OF THE PLANNING, PLANNING COMMISSION, I WILL TRY TO GET WITH, UH, UH, MR. BASSETT AND MR. JURY IN THE NEXT WEEK OR SO BEFORE THE BOARD SUPERVISOR MEETING TO COME UP WITH HOW TO PRESENT THIS.

ALRIGHT, THAT'S FINE WITH ME.

IS THAT OKAY? WELL, IT WOULD BE IN THE, IN THE, IN THE STAFF REPORT TO THE BOARD THAT THE MOTION WAS MADE TO DISAPPROVE, BUT IT WAS A THREE, THREE TIE AND NO OTHER MOTIONS WERE, WERE MADE.

WHAT, UH, WHAT'S THE MEETING DATE OF THE BOARD SUPERVISOR FOR THIS CASE? IS THAT FEBRUARY 21ST? MARCH 21ST.

UH, THANK Y'ALL VERY MUCH.

YOU'RE WELCOME TO STAY AND LISTEN TO THE APPROVAL OF BYLAWS, ET CETERA.

THANK YOU GUYS.

ON THE AGENDA IS APPROVAL OF BYLAWS.

Y'ALL HAVE A SAFE TRIP.

HOME.

NUMBER NINE

[9. APPROVAL OF BY-LAWS ]

MR. CHAIRMAN, MOVE BYLAWS BE APPROVED.

SECOND MOTION BEEN MADE.

AND SECOND, MS. CUNNINGHAM.

BYLAWS BEEN APPROVED.

APPROVAL OF CODE OF ETHICS AND STANDARDS OF CONDUCT.

[10. APPROVAL OF CODE OF ETHICS AND STNDARDS OF CONDUCT ]

MOTION TO APPROVE SECOND CODE OF ETHICS AND STANDARDS OF CONDUCT.

SECOND.

MOTION MADE AND SECOND MOTION.

[11. NEW BUSINESS ]

NEW BUSINESS.

MR. CHAIR, IF I MAY INTERRUPT.

AT THIS TIME, AND IF Y'ALL DON'T MIND, UH, TYLER AND I GOT A HANDS FULL WITH LEGAL MATTERS AND I'VE GOTTA TO COME BACK UP HERE EARLY TOMORROW MORNING AND, UM, AND HOPEFULLY BE STILL COHERENT .

SO IF Y'ALL DON'T MIND ME VACATING Y'ALL, IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANY LEGAL QUESTIONS FOR ME, I'D BE MOST APPRECIATED.

I DO HAVE A QUESTION THAT MAY ROLL OVER INTO YOU AND THAT WAS, UM, RELATED TO THE, UH, FIRST CASE WE HEARD.

I DIDN'T, I TALKED TO MARK ABOUT THIS.

I DIDN'T, I DIDN'T THINK IT WAS GERMANE TO THE CASE ITSELF, BUT THE FOLKS THAT WANTED TO PUT UP THE STORAGE FACILITY HAD GONE OUT AND, AND, UM, GOTTEN A, UM, THEY CLEARED THE LAND WITHOUT A PERMIT, RIGHT? THAT'S CORRECT.

SO I KNOW THAT'S NOT A PERMIT THROUGH THE COUNTY.

I DO UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT, UH, WELL, IT IS, OH, I'M SORRY.

THEY WOULD RECEIVE A LAND DISTURBANCE PERMIT THROUGH THE COUNTY.

SO WHAT MY QUESTION THERE WAS, UM, YOU KNOW, AS IT STANDS, IT WAS WE RECOMMENDED APPROVAL, RIGHT? SO NO HARM, NO FILE IN THAT REGARD, BUT IT COULD HAVE BEEN THE OTHER WAY OR IT STILL MAY BE THE OTHER WAY, RIGHT? YEAH.

AND SO MY POINT IS, I WAS CURIOUS AS TO WHAT, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT IS THEIR, HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH SOMETHING LIKE THAT? WHAT IS THEIR, UM, WHAT'S THE POLICY FOR THAT? OR THE, IS THERE ANY PUNITIVE ACTION FOR THAT OR WHATEVER IT IT CAN BE.

AND MARK YOU, UH, RIGHT NOW WE DON'T HAVE A, UM, STORM WATER PERSON.

THAT'S KIND OF MARK, I GUESS.

RIGHT, RIGHT.

BUT, UM, THERE ARE, IT DEPENDS ON THE SIZE AND WHAT THEY DID AND THE AREA AND WHAT RULES AND RE IF THEY, IF THEY VIOLATED STORM WATER, UH, THEY, IF THEY NEEDED A PERMIT AND THEY VIOLATED IT, UM, YES, THAT COULD BE LEGAL ACTION THEN AND REPAIRS AND THIS SORT OF THING.

SO THEY COULD BE, THE COUNTY USUALLY TRIES TO GET IN THERE AND, AND MAKE PEOPLE COMPLIANT IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME RATHER THAN PUNITIVE.

BUT, UH, THEY COULD BE PUNITIVE ACTION.

I GOT SOMETHING ALONG THAT LINE.

UH, BACK WHEN I WAS ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION THE FIRST TIME WE HAD A CASE COME IN FRONT OF US AND THE PERSON WHO BROUGHT THE CASE FORWARD WAS IN ARREAR ON THEIR TAXES ON THE PROPERTY THAT THEY WANTED US TO

[02:15:01]

DO SOMETHING ON.

AND I ASKED THE QUESTION AT THAT TIME, WHY ON EARTH WOULD WE EVEN HEAR A CASE FOR SOMEBODY WHO ISN'T PAYING THEIR TAXES IN THE COUNTY? AND THAT KIND OF STRUCK THEM AND THEY FINALLY DECIDED, YEAH, THAT'S RIGHT.

WHY WOULD WE DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT? SO THEY MADE IT A RULE.

I THINK THAT YOU HAVE TO, OR THE PROPERTY THAT YOU WANT SOMETHING DONE ON HAS TO BE UP TO DATE ON THEIR TAXES.

I GUESS I WOULD ASK THE SAME QUESTION.

IF SOMEBODY IS VIOLATING THE RULES OF DENWITTY COUNTY ON A PIECE OF PROPERTY, WHY WOULD WE EVEN LISTEN TO A CASE THAT INVOLVES THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY UNTIL THAT HAS BEEN RESOLVED? 'CAUSE HAD I KNOWN THAT, THAT WOULD'VE LED A WHOLE DIFFERENT LIGHT TO THE CONVERSATION TONIGHT.

AND I DID NOT KNOW THAT I'M, I'M NOT, AND THIS IS NOT ME SKIRTING THE ISSUE AT ALL.

I DON'T KNOW THE STATUS OF IT AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

THERE'S A, THEY WERE TOLD, THEY, THEY BASICALLY BEEN ISSUED A STOP WORK ORDER, WHICH THEY COMPLIED WITH AS FAR AS WE KNOW FROM THE POINT WE CONTACTED THEM.

UM, THEY HAVE NOT CONTINUED ANY WORK ON THE PROPERTY, BUT CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, I WOULDN'T LOOKED AT IT AND IT LOOKED LIKE IT WAS PRETTY MUCH THEY'D DONE EVERYTHING.

THAT A FAIR STATEMENT.

I MEAN LIKE 80%, 90%, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

UM, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PERCENT WOULD BE, BUT, UM, IT'S, AS MR. JURY KIND OF INDICATED, IT'S BEEN STAFF'S NORMAL PROCEDURE TO ISSUE A STOP WORK ORDER.

AND IF WE GET COMPLIANCE WITH THAT, UM, THEN WE HAVE NOT PROCEEDED ANY FURTHER WITH ANY TYPE OF LEGAL ACTION.

AND AS MR. DREWRY INDICATED, WHAT WE DO IS TRY TO GET THEM INTO COMPLIANCE WITH OUR RULES AND REGULATIONS.

WELL, I I APOLOGIZE FOR NOT SAYING IT.

I JUST, I DIDN'T, I HAD MY REASONS THAT I WAS AGAINST IT AND I THINK I, I TOOK THE FEELING THAT MOST OF Y'ALL DISAGREE WITH MINE AND THAT'S FINE.

I'M NOT HERE TO, I I TRIED TO SELL YOU ON IT AND IF YOU DIDN'T BUY IT, THAT'S FINE.

BUT I DID, I I I FELT LIKE THAT ISSUE WAS NOT, WAS NOT GERMANE.

THAT'S WHY I DIDN'T BRING IT UP.

SO I APOLOGIZE IF I DIDN'T.

THE CLOSEST I CAME TO THAT WAS WHEN I THINK MR. CLOSE MENTIONED ABOUT A BUFFER AND I SAID THERE WAS NO BUFFER THERE BECAUSE , WHY ISN'T IT GERMANE TO ME IT IS.

IF THEY'RE IN VIOLATION OF DENWITTY COUNTY CODES AND ORDINANCES, IT IS GERMANE TO WHETHER WE WOULD SIT AND LISTEN TO A CASE BROUGHT IN FRONT OF US FROM SOMEBODY WHO HAD NO MORE REGARD FOR THE COUNTY THAN TO DO SOMETHING AGAINST WHAT THE COUNTY WANTED.

AND THAT TO ME IS VERY GERMANE TO WHY WE ARE TO LISTEN.

I AGREE.

BECAUSE IT WOULD'VE AFFECTED THE WAY I THOUGHT ABOUT IT.

WELL, I ASSUMED MAYBE INCORRECTLY, BUT I ASSUMED IT WAS AN HONEST MISTAKE.

I DID NOT SEE IT AS SOMEBODY GOING OUT AND JUST GOING WILLY NILLY, YOU KNOW? BUT I APOLOGIZE ABOUT LET AND LET ME SEE THIS AND I UNDERSTAND YOUR POSITION.

I UNDERSTAND IT AND EVERYTHING.

AND, AND QUITE FRANKLY, I DIDN'T REALIZE IT EITHER.

BUT, BUT, BUT THE POSITION HAS BEEN IS THAT D WHI COUNTY IS NOT STAFFED UP LIKE CHESTERFIELD AND MORE AGGRESSIVE COUNTIES, PERIOD.

AND I WILL SAY THIS, AND MAYBE I SHOULD OR SHOULDN'T, DENWITTY IS A KIND PLACE.

YOU KNOW, THAT CAME OUT AFTER THE FACT.

AND SO, NO.

AND SO AS STAFF HERE AND EVEN MYSELF AS LEGAL, TYPICALLY I APPROACH HAS BEEN TO HELP PEOPLE AND THAT PUNISH THEM.

UNLESS, UNLESS IT IS REALLY EGREGIOUS.

LIKE IF THEY DIDN'T, I'M NOT GONNA HEAR ABOUT THAT UNLESS THEY, UM, DON'T COMPLY WITH A STOP WORK ORDER, I GUESS IS WHAT I'M, WHAT I'M SAYING.

AND THE NEXT THING I'LL SAY AND COULD, IT IS HARD TO JUDGE WHERE IT'S NAIVETY.

UM, OR WHETHER IT'S EGREGIOUS FOR SOME REASON.

I DON'T KNOW WHETHER, AND I'M NOT JUDGING THEM AT ALL.

I DON'T KNOW WHY THIS IS, AND MAYBE IT'S IT SEEMS LIKE TO ME THERE'S MORE OF THIS SORT OF THING GOING ON NOW IN SOCIETY AND EVEN IN DWI COUNTY THAN IT WAS PRE COVID.

WE, AND THE REASON I WAS TELLING Y'ALL THAT TYLER AND I ARE UP TO OUR EYEBALLS AND STUFF, PEOPLE DON'T LIKE TO BE COMPLIANT.

AND THIS IS NOT A COMMENT ABOUT DENWOOD COUNTY.

IT'S JUST THAT AS SIMPLE AS COMING IN AND GETTING A BUSINESS PERMIT.

WELL, IF YOU UNDERSTAND, OH, A BUILDING PERMIT, I, I FEEL BADLY FOR MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS HERE.

I TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THAT.

I, I, AND I WOULD SAY THAT I THINK SINCE YOU GUYS KNEW ABOUT IT, THAT THERE'S SOME RESPONSIBILITY THERE.

BUT WHAT I WOULD SAY, THIS IS FROM MY MAYOR CULPA TO YOU ALL, IS THAT, IS IT IS, WOULDN'T IT BE APPROPRIATE WITH MR. PRO GOING TO REPRESENT THE, THE CASE NEXT MONTH THAT HE CAN SAY THAT,

[02:20:01]

WOULD THAT BE A, WOULD THAT NOT BE APPROPRIATE MARK AND THEM IT WOULD BE LEGALLY APPROPRIATE.

BUT Y'ALL WORK WITH THE CLIENT DIDN'T KNOW THE SITUATION.

I DON'T, I I'M, I'M GONNA TELL YOU ONE LAST THING ABOUT THAT.

DENWOODY COUNTY HAS BEEN, AS MR. JURY SAID, VERY FRIENDLY.

IT IS EASIER TO COMMIT THE CRIME AND PAY THE FEE THAN TO GO GET THE PERMIT AND DO THE JOB THE RIGHT WAY.

TO ME, THAT'S WHERE THIS COUNTY'S BACKWARDS.

UH, I REMEMBER WHEN, UH, REN FOREST WAS BEING DEVELOPED AND THE PIECE THAT, UH, THE CURRENT HINSHAW THAT'S BUILDING THE HOUSES ON THE EAST SIDE, THEY CLEARED A BUNCH OF LAND IN THERE, DIDN'T GO GET PERMITS OR ANYTHING.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS THAT ONE, WHOEVER OWNED IT BEFORE HIM.

WHOEVER.

I WOULD JUST REMEMBER I WAS PART OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION WHEN THAT WAS GOING ON.

AND THE FINE WAS WAY, I MEAN, IT WAS CHEAP.

IT WOULD'VE BEEN EASIER JUST TO GO AHEAD AND DO IT AND PAY THE FINE FOR DOING WHAT YOU DID, CLEARING SOME PROPERTY WITHOUT PERMITS THAN TO WORRY ABOUT GOING TO GET THE PERMITS AND DO EVERYTHING.

I MEAN, I'VE HAD SEVERAL PEOPLE IN THE COUNTY SAY IT'S BETTER TO ASK FORGIVENESS IN THIS COUNTY THAN TO ASK FOR ACCEPTANCE FOR SOMETHING IN THIS COUNTY.

AND THAT TO ME IS A PROBLEM.

IT POINTS WELL TAKEN.

MY ASSUMPTION IS THAT, UH, ANY FURTHER, UH, STEPS IN THE PROCESS WOULD NOT HAPPEN UNTIL THE STOP WORK ORDER HAS BEEN SATISFIED.

CAN I ASSUME THAT, IN OTHER WORDS, IF HE HAS HONORED THE STOP WORK ORDER, HE HAS NOT DONE ANY FURTHER WORK ON THE SITE OKAY.

SINCE HE WAS CONTACTED.

SO WE KNOW THAT, THAT THAT'S DIFFERENT.

IT'S KIND OF LIKE A BUILDING CODE VIOLATION.

YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T GET AN OCCUPANCY PERMIT UNTIL BUILDING CODE IS SATISFIED.

WELL, YOU KNOW, IF THEY HAVEN'T DONE SOMETHING PROPERLY, THEN THEY DON'T GET AN OCCUPANCY PERMIT.

SO YOU HOLD THAT OVER 'EM.

UM, OR TO GET COMPLIANCE.

SO, SO BASICALLY THAT GUY DID ALL THE WORK BEFORE HE GOT CAUGHT, RIGHT? YOU WANT A HAMBURGER? WELL, MY EXCUSE IS, I WAS LOOKING AT THIS AS A LAND NO, I WAS TRYING TO SEPARATE THE LAND USE DISCUSSION FROM THE PERMIT DISCUSSION.

AND THAT'S THE REASON WHY I DID WHAT I DID.

BUT I'M, I APOLOGIZE TO YOU.

I DON'T, AGAIN, I DON'T THINK THAT, I THINK THIS DISCUSSION'S EXCELLENT.

I THINK WE ALL HAVE LEARNED A LOT, BUT IT'S A THREE, TWO VOTE.

IT WOULD BE THE SAME THING IF WE WAS THREE, TWO THE OTHER WAY.

UH, FOUR TWO.

I GUESS IT WAS THREE.

WELL, I GUESS MY POINT IS THAT BASED ON WHAT, BASED ON THE REACTION YOU GUYS HAD, I'M JUST RECOMMENDING THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IF Y'ALL AGREE, I'D LIKE TO SEE OUR CHAIRMAN EXPRESS, YOU KNOW THAT.

AND I, AND I WILL CERTAINLY DO THAT.

'CAUSE THAT'S PART OF THE DISCUSSION AND THE MINUTES WILL, WILL REFLECT THAT.

UM, AND SO, YOU KNOW, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH DOING THAT.

UH, MY, I THINK MY JOB IS TO CONVEY WHAT THE BOARD IS, UM, EXPRESSED.

AND UM, THAT'S ALWAYS TOUGHEST WHEN YOU HAVE A SPLIT VOTE TOO.

WELL THAT'S OKAY.

THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S REASON YOU GOT THE SYSTEM TO DO.

WELL THAT'S, THAT'S UM, DENWITTY COUNTY, UM, IT'S GOVERNMENT AND EVEN COMMUNITY.

I CALL IT MATURING.

WHEN I FIRST CAME UP HERE IN 2000, EARLY 2000, THERE WAS A LOT OF IMPROVEMENTS THAT NEEDED TO BE MADE.

AND THE, EVEN THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, UM, EXPRESSED TO ME THAT THEY WANTED YOU UNDERSTAND ME MORE PROFESSIONALISM AND RAISE IT UP THE LEVEL.

AND, AND WHAT I'M REALLY TELLING YOU THE STORY FOR IS THE FACT THAT, IN OTHER WORDS, THIS MIGHT BE A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION THAT Y'ALL NEED TO HAVE WITH THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AS WELL, IS YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M GETTING AT MM-HMM .

IN OTHER WORDS, HOW AGGRESSIVE DO YOU WANT STAFF TO BE IN EVEN STAFFING? 'CAUSE IT, 'CAUSE I'M JUST GOING TO ADMIT IT RIGHT NOW AND MARK BACK ME UP ON THIS CODE COMPLIANCE, FOR INSTANCE, IN DENWITTY COUNTY AND IN MOST RURAL COMMUNITIES, IT'S, UH, COMPLAINT DRIVEN.

THE COUNTY IS NOT DRIVING AROUND LOOKING FOR CODE VIOLATIONS.

AND IT'S THE SAME THING HERE.

BUT YET YOU GET DOWN IN, IN A CHESTER APPEAL.

I DOUBT THAT'S THE WAY IT IS.

IN OTHER WORDS, YOU UNDERSTAND ME, YOU GOT A COMPLIANT STAFF, RIGHT.

AND YOU DON'T HAVE IT.

I MEAN, WHEN I GO TO MEETINGS IN HERE, SOME OF THE OTHER JURISDICTIONS TALK ABOUT IT.

YES, YOU'RE RIGHT.

YOU GOT ONE ATTORNEY THAT'S TOTALLY

[02:25:01]

ON CODE COMPLIANCE.

WE DON'T HAVE THAT ABILITY HERE.

AND SO IT'S COMPLAINT DRIVEN, BUT I HAVEN'T, WELL, DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING IS THAT I DID MAKE THE, UH, COMMENT DURING OUR WORK SESSION WITH THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS LAST MONTH THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE NEED TO DO IS TO PROVIDE MORE STAFF TO DO THE THINGS THAT WE'RE ASKING HIM TO DO.

YOU CAN'T EXPECT MARK AND, AND BRAD, EXCUSE ME, TO, TO DO ALL THE THINGS THAT WE ARE SAYING OUGHT TO BE DONE.

YOU KNOW, I'M FAMOUS FOR SAYING THAT IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA ENFORCE THE LAW, DON'T HAVE A LAW.

AND I, AND I BELIEVE THAT, BUT SOMETIMES YOU CAN'T ENFORCE IT BECAUSE THERE'S NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE TO GO OUT THERE.

UM, AND I THINK WE'LL MAKE THAT CASE AGAIN, BUT THEY, THEY KNOW WHAT WE'RE SAYING AND THAT'S, THAT'S FOR THEM TO DECIDE.

I KNOW.

AND I, AND I, THE REASON I BRING IT UP, 'CAUSE WHEN I CAME HERE TO WORK, IT, IT, I DON'T KNOW, IT WAS A YEAR OR MORE.

THEY WANTED TO BE MORE AGGRESSIVE ON CODE COMPLIANCE.

AND I'D SAY, WELL, WAIT A MINUTE, THAT'S FINE, BUT HERE ARE THE ISSUES THAT I'M HAVING TO HANDLE AND I CAN TELL YOU, 'CAUSE I FOLLOWED IT, HOW MANY HOURS A WEEK I'M HANDLING ON THIS.

SO IF I DO CODE ENFORCEMENT, I'VE GOTTA DROP DID SOME OF THESE OTHER THINGS.

AND, UH, EVEN NOW, I MEAN, I'M, I'M PART-TIME UP HERE AND I'M NOT FUSSING ABOUT THAT AT ALL.

UM, BUT YOU HEAR WHERE I'M DRIVING.

OH YEAH.

IN OTHER WORDS, RIGHT NOW WE DON'T HAVE TIME TO ADEQUATELY DO, UM, ORDINANCE AMENDMENTS THAT WE'D LIKE TO SEE DONE.

SO, SO, SO WHAT IS THE LIMIT OF THE SIZE OF THE PROPERTY THAT YOU HAVE TO HAVE A PERMIT TO, TO CLEAR OFF OVER ONE ACRE OR 0.99 TENTHS OF AN ACRE OF YOUR OWN PROPERTY? RIGHT.

WELL, NO, WHEN YOU'RE CLEAR, TECHNICALLY WHEN YOU'RE CLEARING ANY PROPERTY, YOU, YOU SHOULD HAVE A LAND DISTURBANCE PERMIT.

UM, UNLESS IT'S FOR AN AGRICULTURAL USE.

SO IF, IF YOU'RE LESS THAN AN ACRE, YOU WOULD GET AN AGREEMENT IN LIEU OF, UM, ONCE YOU GET OVER AN ACRE, EVEN IF IT'S COMMERCIAL PROPERTY, THAT TYPE OF THING, YOU'RE, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE SOME TYPE OF ENS PLAN IF YOU'RE GONNA CLEAR THE PROPERTY, EVEN IF IT'S LESS THAN AN ACRE.

ONCE YOU GET OVER AN ACRE, YOU'VE GOTTA DO STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.

SO YOU HAVE TO HAVE AN ENS PLAN AND THEN ALSO A STORMWATER MANAGEMENT PLAN.

AND, AND THAT'S FOR A NON A TWO, I MEAN NON WELL, IT'S HOW YOU USE THE PROPERTY.

IT'S NOT HOW IT'S OWNED, IT'S HOW YOU'RE USING THE PROPERTY.

SO IF IT'S FOR, YOU KNOW, LIKE I SAID, AN AGRICULTURAL TYPE USE OR FARM USE, UM, TIMBER PROPERTY, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE THAT LAND DISTURBANCE PERMIT IS WHEN I ARRIVED BY THERE BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE LINES ARE.

I WAS THINKING THAT IT WAS MORE THAN JUST THIS, WHATEVER THIS SMALL AGENT IS, IT'S ALL BACK AROUND IT SOUTH OF IT AND BACK OF IT.

UH, I THINK IT'S THE ONE LOT OF, OF THE PROPERTY YOU DID, YOU HAD REZONED, YOUR FAMILY HAD REZONED.

IT WAS ONE LOT OF THAT.

RIGHT? RIGHT.

THEY DID TAKE, I WAS THINKING IT WAS JUST ONE LOT.

IT'S FAIRLY DEEP BUT PRETTY NARROW UHHUH I THINK.

YOU GO BACK THERE WHEN YOU I MAY WRITE, I MEAN, I TOOK, SOMEBODY BROUGHT IT UP TO ME AT CHURCH AND I WAS IN MY CAR AND I WENT DOWN THERE AND I DIDN'T THINK I WAS GONNA GET BACK AT IT .

I WAS LIKE, I WISH I'D BOUGHT MY TRUCK THE LONG TRUCKS.

THAT WAS MY POINT ABOUT THE FURNACE ROAD.

THAT FRONT ROAD IS NOT VERY GOOD SHAPE.

WELL, WE'LL TRY TO COMMUNICATE THAT WITH THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND MAKE IT IT CLEAR WE KNOW HOW.

BUT I WOULD SAY THAT YOU, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY HAS A BOARD OF SUPERVISOR EVERY PLANNING COMMISSIONER AND I, AM I CORRECT IN ASSUMING THAT IT'S ALL RIGHT TO TO, IF YOU'VE GOT A QUESTION ABOUT THAT TO GO TALK TO YOUR SUPERVISOR? I, I WOULDN'T FOLLOW ON YOU REAL CLEAR.

I MEAN, IF, IF I, IF I WENT TO SAY, HARRISON, I'M, I WANNA TALK TO YOU ABOUT THIS BECAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT IT.

JUST, JUST A A HEADS UP.

IS THAT APPROPRIATE, YOU THINK? SURE.

ALL PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE.

APPROVAL AND DISAPPROVAL.

UH, THANK YOU FOR STICKING WITH US.

THAT'S, UH, BUT I GOT A QUESTION FOR MARK FOR TUCO NOW OKAY.

WITH THIS AND EVERYTHING.

SO I'M PRESUMING THAT THEY'RE NOT DOING ANY MORE WORK NOW.

AND IF, AND THEY'RE NOT DOING AN ENS AT THIS POINT UNTIL THEY GET APPROVAL.

WELL, WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WE WILL HAVE TO FOLLOW UP WITH THEM EITHER WAY, APPROVAL OR DISAPPROVAL.

WE'LL HAVE TO GET 'EM INTO COMPLIANCE ON THAT SITE.

SO, SO HOW DO YOU MAKE, HOW DO YOU GET SOMEONE IN COMPLIANCE IF IT'S ON, IF IT'S NOT APPROVED? NO, UM,

[02:30:01]

I'M TALKING ABOUT THE ZONING ASPECTS OF IT.

SO OUTSIDE OF THAT, WE WILL BE WORKING WITH THE APPLICANT ON ANY DISTURBANCE ON THE SITE FROM AN ENS AND STORM WATER MANAGEMENT STANDPOINT.

WELL, NO, MY, MY, MY QUESTION WAS, SO TWO SEPARATE ISSUES, I GUESS I'M NOT FOLLOWING.

SO IF HE, IF HE GETS APPROVED TO DO WHAT HE IS GOTTA DO AND HE GRADES IT OFF AND EVERYTHING, I UNDERSTAND THE ENS THAT COMES ALONG WITH THAT.

I'M SAYING IF IT GETS UNDER, IF IT'S DISAPPROVED, ULTIMATELY HE WILL STILL HAVE TO COME TO COMPLIANCE WITH US RELATED TO ENS AND STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.

SO YOU'RE SAYING BOARD SUPERVISORS, UH, DOES NOT APPROVE IT.

THEY STILL GOT TO DO WHAT THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE DONE TO BEGIN WITH.

RIGHT THROUGH THE PERMITTING PROCESS.

THIS IS NOT THE FIRST, THERE'S OTHER SITES WHERE THIS HAS HAPPENED AND WE'VE HAD TO BRING THE PROPERTY OWNER INTO COMPLIANCE BECAUSE IT'S NOT UNUSUAL.

UNFORTUNATELY.

SWEAR OF MOUTH.

WELL, I'M GLAD TO HEAR HE'S STOPPED.

I'LL BE THE FIRST TO ADMIT AS A RURAL LANDOWNER MYSELF, BUT, UH, AS MR. TIPMAN SAYS, SOMETIMES IT'S EASY TO GO DO SOMETHING.

'CAUSE THE COUNTY'S I DEAL WITH ARE NOT AS GOOD AS Y'ALL ARE OVER HERE.

AND SOMETIMES WHEN I ASK A QUESTION, I GET STRANGE THINGS BACK.

WELL, MY PHILOSOPHY IS NEVER ASKED A QUESTION WHOSE ANSWER YOU, YOU CANNOT LIVE WITH .

WELL, I'VE BEEN TOLD I DIDN'T LIVE IN THAT COUNTY BEFORE.

AND I WAS LIKE, OKAY, COULD YOU PUT THAT IN WRITING? AND .

AND THERE'S A TRIAL COMING UP NEXT WEEK AND, UH, YOU HAVEN'T STARTED THAT ONE YET.

IT DEPENDS ON WHAT YOUR DEFINITION OF STARTED YET IS.

I MEAN, BEFORE A JUDGE, UH, UH, WE'VE BEEN BEFORE THE JUDGE ON SOME MOTIONS.

OH.

AND, UH, THE, THE TRIAL IS NEXT, NEXT, UH, THURSDAY.

THE 16TH, RIGHT? YES.

DIDN'T KNOW WHAT YOU SAID.

YEP.

IT'S MORNING OF THE 16TH.

GOOD LUCK.

SO WHAT IS THAT? I GOT CURIOSITY THERE.

THE YOST VERSUS ITY BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.

AND WHO WAS THAT? BEHIND THE WINERY THOUGH, WAS THE PROPOSED WINERY.

I GOTCHA, I GOTCHA THEN.

UNDERSTOOD.

LOT LOTS GOING ON.

SO YOU THE COUNTY'S THE DEFENDANT? YES.

WE GET CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF A LOT OF THINGS.

COMMENTS? WHAT YOU GOT COOKING FOR MARCH? UH, FOR MARCH.

HAVE A GOOD THANK YOU.

BE SAFE.

UH, ANY OTHER NEW BUSINESS BEFORE WE MOVE ON TO PLANNING COMMISSIONER

[12. COMMISSIONERS' COMMENTS ]

WE, THE POND SOLAR PROJECT SHOULD BE COMING BEFORE YOU ALL FOR PUBLIC HEARING.

COULD YOU ELABORATE REAL QUICKLY ABOUT WHAT YOU TOLD ME THE OTHER DAY ABOUT? 'CAUSE I WANT, I NEVER DID FIND THE BILL NUMBER.

YOU SAID IT WAS A BILL IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY ABOUT LAND USE THAT WAS RELATED TO SOLAR PROJECTS.

YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.

I DON'T HAVE THAT INFORMATION WITH ME.

I'M SORRY TO GIVE YOU ANY MORE SPECIFICS ON IT.

I DON'T HAVE THE YES, I WAS LOOKING IT UP.

I JUST COULDN'T FIND IT.

I I WILL DEFINITELY FORWARD THAT TO YOU.

TO ALL OF YOU.

BUT TO, TO, TO, UH, PARAPHRASE YOU, IT WAS A, IT WAS A, A BILL SPONSORED BY SOMEONE WHO WANTED TO HAVE MORE COMMONWEALTH CONTROL OVER LOCALITIES LAND USE DECISIONS AS IT RELATES TO SILVER.

IS THAT A FAIR RIGHT.

THE LAND USE DECISION, ALSO THE CITING AGREEMENTS.

AH, RIGHT, RIGHT.

THERE WAS DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT.

ANY OTHER, UH, SO IS THIS, EXCUSE ME.

NOT THE FIRST, THE SECOND ONE, UM, I CAN'T REMEMBER WHICH COMPANY IT WAS, BUT THERE, AND IT WAS A HISTORICAL SITE SITUATION, UM, THAT CAME UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT.

THE, UM, SAME, UH, PROPERTY THAT WAS BOUGHT.

WE, WE, IT, IT IS, UH, VERY SIMILAR PROPERTIES.

6 68 MAYBE OFF OF BRICK ROAD AND YEAH.

SIMILAR, VERY SIMILAR CASE.

THEY'VE ACTUALLY ADDED ACREAGE TO THE REQUEST THIS TIME.

UM, SO THERE'S MORE PROPERTY INCLUDED IN THE REQUEST.

UM, AND THEY WITHDREW THAT CASE.

BUT I DO WANT TO MENTION THAT THE VERY FIRST ONE, WELL,

[02:35:01]

AND, UM, ACTUALLY, THEY'RE ACTUALLY STILL PAYING THE, THE LANDOWNERS.

UM, RORY IS OFF OF THAT BECAUSE THEY HAD ALREADY AGREED TO IT PRIOR TO EVEN COMING TO, TO GETTING EVERYTHING APPROVED.

SO, SO THAT THE LANDOWNER IS STILL GETTING RENT PAYMENTS FROM THEM.

NOW THAT'S KINDA LIKE THE PIPELINE.

SAME THING.

IF, UH, THEY THEY WANTED TO TAKE YOUR LAND AND IF THEY, IF YOU AGREED TO SELL IT TO 'EM, THEN, THEN THEY QUIT WITH ALL THE LEGAL STUFF.

AND SO THE LANDOWNERS KEPT THE MONEY MM-HMM .

WHERE THE WORLD IS.

I THINK THEY HAVE SOLD IT TO THE CONTRACT TO ANOTHER COMPANY.

NOW, YOU KNOW, IT, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS DRIVING THIS SEVERAL YEARS AGO WHEN THE DISCUSSIONS FIRST CAME UP BY CREATING ALL THIS GREEN ENERGY WAS THAT ALL OF THESE, UH, SERVERS UP IN NORTHERN VIRGINIA WERE SUCH ENERGY HOGS THAT THEY NEEDED TO BE ABLE TO OFFSET THAT MORE ELECTRICITY USED BY SOLAR MM-HMM .

AND IT WAS CHEAPER TO COME DOWN HERE AND USE OUR LAND, UH, TO, TO PROVIDE IT.

AND SO I GUESS WHAT I'M THINKING IS THAT IF YOU BUILD A SERVER DOWN HERE BESIDE THE SOLAR COMPLEX AND CREATE A THOUSAND JOBS, BUT THEY'RE NOT CREATING THAT KIND OF JUDGE, GO LOOK AT THE CASE IN PRINCE WILLIAM COUNTY RIGHT NOW FOR DATA CENTERS AND LOOK AT AND READ THE COMMENTS THAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING ABOUT IT.

WELL, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW, BUT I MEAN, IF THEY WOULD DO SOMETHING, THEY WOULD CREATE, YOU KNOW, LIKE AMAZON, YOU KNOW, 10,000 JOBS OR, OR A THOUSAND JOBS, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

WELL, THE GENERAL, THE GENERAL READ THAT I GET OF THE PEOPLE COMPLAIN ABOUT IT IS THAT IT'S A NOISE AND A SITE ISSUE AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE THE SOLAR FACILITY, IT'S A NUMBER OF JOBS, YOU KNOW, DURING CONSTRUCTION, WHAT YOU GIVE UP.

VERY MINIMAL.

I'M THINKING THAT OPERATING THAT, THAT'S MY BIGGEST CONCERN.

BUT, UH, IF, IF THEY'RE HAVING A LOT OF DISCUSSION UP THERE, THEN I THINK THAT MAKES ME NOT WORRY ABOUT THE LEGISLATURE QUITE AS MUCH.

UM, WELL, I MEAN THE MORE, I MEAN, YOU USED TO THINK OF SOUTH SIDE, VIRGINIA, RURAL COUNTIES, POOR COUNTIES, YOU KNOW, THE ONES THAT ARE DEALING WITH THIS, NOT AWAY AND SU THEN WITH AND SO ON AND SO FORTH.

BUT IF SOME OF THESE HIGH POPULATION COUNTIES WITH MORE VOTERS, YOU WOULD THINK THAT THAT WOULD HAVE MORE INFLUENCE THAN, THAN OUR LITTLE DELEGATION.

I I, WELL, I, I'M INTERESTED IN SEEING THE BILL.

THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING ABOUT IT.

'CAUSE I GUARANTEE YOU, I, I'LL BE WILLING TO BET THIS TO ANYBODY, A BEER TO ANYBODY HERE THAT LIKES TO DRINK A BEER, THAT THE, THAT THE SPONSOR OR SPONSORS HAVE SAID BILL COME FROM A HIGHER POPULATED COUNTY.

OH, I WOULDN'T BE SURPRISED.

BUT I'M JUST SAYING IT'S THAT, JUST KNOWING THAT SOME OF 'EM UP THERE ARE NOT HAPPY.

IT'S BETTER THAN NONE.

ALL OF 'EM UP THERE BEING HAPPY WE'RE FLY OVER COUNTRY TO THEM.

WELL, ANY OF THE COMMENTS FROM THE COMMISSIONERS? NOPE.

UH, MOVING ALONG, UH, DIRECTOR COMMENTS? I HAVE NO ADDITIONAL COMMENTS.

MR. CHAIR.

MR. TIP.

HAVE ONE.

I WAS JUST GONNA MAKE THE COMMENT, YOU KNOW, TONIGHT WE WERE TALKING AND THEN YOU GOT TO ASKING ABOUT BUFFERS ON THAT FIRST, UH, PROPERTY.

AND, AND NO DISRESPECT TO PLANNING BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PEOPLE.

WE ALREADY KNOW THAT I, I, IT IS NO NEED TO EVEN TALK ABOUT BUFFERS ANYMORE.

IT'S NO NEED TO TALK ABOUT CERTAIN THINGS BECAUSE THERE'S NOBODY THERE THAT'S GONNA ENFORCE IT TO BEGIN WITH.

I CAN CARRY, I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PLACES THAT HAD BUFFERS PUT ON 'EM.

AND THERE'S NO BUFFER ANYMORE.

AND IT'S HARD.

NOTHING'S GONNA HAPPEN.

IT'S HARD TO REESTABLISH, ISN'T IT? RIGHT.

I KNOW A COUPLE CASES WHERE THE CONDITION HOUSTON WERE GIVEN AND LIKE THE TREES IN FRONT, THE PROPERTY WERE SUPPOSED TO BE BEAUTIFUL.

TREES SUPPOSED TO BE LEFT THERE.

NEXT THING YOU KNEW THEY WERE GONE.

THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING.

I MEAN, YOU, YOU SAVED WELL BUFFER AND THEN THEY JUST DISAPPEAR IN IT.

YARD AND, WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT CAMERA PUT A DRIVEWAY RIGHT STRAIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE CURB.

I KNOW.

OCCURRED WELL ANYWAY.

UH, PLANNING DIRECTOR, NO COMMENTS.

MARK? NO.

MR. CHAIR.