[1. CALL TO ORDER]
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I'D LIKE TO CALL THE OCTOBER 11TH, UH, WORKSHOP MEETING TO ORDER.[3. APPROVAL OF AGENDA]
I NEED A MOTION TO APPROVE THE AGENDA.SO I WANNA KNOW WHAT MR. T AMENDMENT DISCUSSION.
UH, BEFORE I GET STARTED ON THE, UM, WORK THAT MR. DREW'S DONE ON THE PROPOSED ZONING ORDINANCE, TEXT AMENDMENT, JUST LIKE TO WELCOME, UH, MR. LANGLEY, UH, TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
HE'S OUR NEWLY APPOINTED, UH, PLANNING COMMISSION MEMBER FROM DISTRICT ONE.
AND HE, UH, RESIDES IN THE CHURCH ROAD AREA, I BELIEVE.
SO WE HAVE CHURCH ROAD REPRESENTATION NOW ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
ALL Y'ALL KNOW WHERE JACK BENNETT LIVED TOBACCO FARM AT ONE TIME.
AND BENNY, HE, THE OLD SHIRT USED TO LIVE.
I BOUGHT BENNY HEATH SOLD HOME PLACE.
YOU'RE DOING TOBACCO NOW? NO, SIR.
UM, I'M THE HEAD ANIMAL CONTROL OFFICER FOR DENVER COUNTY.
I'M THE HEAD ANIMAL CONTROL OFFICER FOR ITY COUNTY.
YOU SNAKES BETTER BE CAREFUL AROUND HERE.
I TOLD HIM I MIGHT BE CALLING YOU TO KIND OF PICK YOUR BRAIN, SEE WHERE YOU'RE AT AND WHERE WE AT SO I CAN GET SOME MORE INSIGHT.
I'VE BEEN TALKING WITH MR. TIP IS HERE FOR A WHILE.
[4. ZONING ORDINANCE TEXT AMENDMENT DISCUSSION – MICHAEL DREWRY, DEPUTY COUNTY ATTORNEY AND MARK BASSETT, PLANNING DIRECTOR]
FIRST ITEM WE HAVE ON THE AGENDA RELATED TO, UH, TOPICS FOR DISCUSSION TONIGHT.UH, MR. DREWRY HAS BEEN WORKING ON A TEXT AMENDMENT OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
AND, UM, YOU ALL, UH, I PASSED THAT OUT TO YOU EARLIER.
UM, THIS IS WORK, UH, THAT HE'S DONE ON, UH, THIS SECTION.
THIS SECTION'S RELATED TO CONDITIONAL ZONING, UM, THAT'S ALLOWED PER THE, UM, VIRGINIA CODE.
AND WE'VE HAD IT IN THE ORDINANCE FOR MANY YEARS NOW.
AND THERE HAVE BEEN SOME, UH, LEGISLATIVE UPDATES, UH, TO THE VIRGINIA CODE, UM, THAT, UH, RELATE TO THIS, UH, ZONING ORDINANCE SECTION.
AND WE DO NEED TO MAKE SOME UPDATES TO THAT.
PLUS, UH, MR. DRURY ALSO HAS SOME RECOMMENDATIONS, UH, RELATED TO, AS YOU'LL SEE, KIND OF SOME PROCEDURAL RECOMMENDATIONS RELATED TO, UH, RECEIVING PROFFERS, MAINLY FROM THE STAFF STANDPOINT, UM, TO ALLOW STAFF TIME TO WORK WITH THE APPLICANT ON PROFFERS AND JUST BASIC REVIEW TIME, UH, FOR THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AS WELL IN ADDITION TO PLANNING STAFF.
UM, I THINK YOU ALL HAVE SEEN IN SOME PAST CASES WE'VE HAD SOME, UH, BACK AND FORTH WITH VARIOUS APPLICANTS RELATED TO, UH, PROFFERS, UH, WHEN WE RECEIVED 'EM, COMMENTS BACK, THOSE KIND OF THINGS.
UH, JUST, UM, ADMINISTRATIVE, UH, DETAILS RELATED TO PROFFERS, UH, WITH, UH, OVER THE YEARS.
SO, UM, SOME, UH, UH, MR. DREW'S SUGGESTIONS WE MAY WANT TO IMPLEMENT, UH, THAT HE SET FORTH IN THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE.
SO I THINK I'LL TURN IT OVER TO MIKE SINCE SEED, UH, REALLY DID ALL THE WORK ON THIS TEXT AMENDMENT AND JUST LET HIM FOLLOW UP WITH ANY ITEMS THAT HE'D LIKE TO EMPHASIZE RELATED TO THE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS.
I DIDN'T KNOW I WAS GOING TO TALK TO YOU.
SO THE, THE MAIN THING WITH THIS IS THAT THE VIRGINIA CODE HAS CHANGED LONG AGO WHEN I CAME TO DEN WITTY, AND IT'S BEEN A WHILE NOW, BUT, UM, THE VIRGINIA CODE ALLOWED DEN WITTY COUNTY TO COLLECT CASH PROFITS.
AND THAT'S THAT 22, UM, 98 IN OTHER WORDS.
AND SO THAT'S THE MAIN THING THAT WE NEED TO CHANGE IT AS TO WHAT SECTION OF THE VIRGINIA
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CODE.AND YOU'LL SEE THAT IN ACTUALLY IN THE FIRST SENTENCE ON THE 22 DASH 24 PURSUANT TO 15.22297.
BUT, UM, IN C UNDER THAT SAME SECTION, I, AND THIS HAS BEEN AN ISSUE AGAIN EVER SINCE I CAME TO D WITTY COUNTY, UH, APPLICANTS ARE NOT VERY GOOD AT TURNING IN TIMELY FOR OFFERS.
AND IT'S KIND OF UP TO Y'ALL, KIND OF UP TO, TO STAFF AS TO WHAT THEY WANT TO DO ABOUT IT.
UH, SOME, SOME COUNTIES ARE PRETTY STRICT.
THE LOCALITIES ARE PRETTY STRICT ON WHEN YOU, UH, HAVE TO SUBMIT A PROFFER IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME.
AND, UM, OR IT WON'T GO FORTH.
AND, AND, AND IT'S STILL AN ISSUE.
IN FACT, I THINK THERE'S A, A ITEM THAT Y'ALL HEARD
BUT, UM, BUT THAT'S IN C UH, TIME TO SUBMIT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THERE.
THERE'S NOTHING LEGALLY REQUIRING YOU TO DO IT.
UM, BUT AGAIN, MARK, Y'ALL MIGHT WANT TO WEIGH IN ON, ON THAT.
UH, AGAIN, THE MAIN THRUST OF THIS WAS GETTING THE CORRECT CODE SECTION IN IT SO WE CAN ENFORCE IT.
AND DO YOU WANNA PUT A TIME LIMIT, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME WHEN APPLICANTS, UH, HAVE TO SUBMIT TO PROFITS? UH, I, I I'LL SAY I, I SUGGEST YOU DO.
UM, 'CAUSE QUITE FRANKLY, WE, I GET TIRED OF SEEING STAFF BEING HANDED PROS THE DAY OF ONE OF Y'ALL'S MEETINGS.
BUT MARK, YOU GOT ANYTHING TO SAY ABOUT THAT? UM, YES.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ALL, UH, HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ON TIMING OF, UH, WHEN PROFFERS SHOULD BE SUBMITTED AS PART OF AN APPLICATION? UH, AS, AS MR. JURY'S INDICATED AT SEVERAL OF OUR PAST PUBLIC HEARINGS WHERE WE'RE CONSIDERING REZONINGS AND PROFFERS RELATED TO THOSE REZONINGS, AN APPLICANT CAN LEGALLY ANYWAY SUBMIT PROFFERS UP TO THE POINT, UH, PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC HEARING THAT EVENING.
BUT IT MAKES IT DIFFICULT FOR YOU ALL STAFF, UM, THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE TO, YOU KNOW, HAVE ADEQUATE TIME TO REVIEW THOSE, THOSE PROFFERS.
SO WE HAVE TALKED INTERNALLY AS MIKE INDICATED, UH, ABOUT PERHAPS HAVING SOMETHING IN THE ORDINANCE, UH, SO MANY DAYS PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC HEARING.
THOSE PROFFERS HAVE TO BE SUBMITTED.
UM, YEAH, I'LL, I'LL ADD TO THAT MM-HMM
FROM A LEGAL STANDPOINT, I LIKE TO SEE 'EM SOMETHING IN, UM, EVEN IF IT'S A DRAFT, WHEN THE PUBLIC ADVERTISEMENT COMES OUT.
'CAUSE SOME PUBLIC DO WANT TO SEE THAT.
AND I DON'T THINK IT'S VERY FAIR.
YOU UNDERSTAND ME TO THE PUBLIC IF YOU'RE ADVERTISING FOR REZONING AND NOT BEING ABLE TO, YOU KNOW, SEE WHAT THE, THE APPLICANT IS SOLVING.
SO WE TRY TO GET 'EM TO HOLD TO THAT.
BUT IT DOESN'T WORK SOMETIMES.
THAT, THAT SIX WEEKS PRIOR TO THE MEETING IS WHEN Y'ALL ADVERTISE.
IS IT SIX WEEK? HOW, WHAT'S THE ADVERTISEMENT LENGTH OF TIME PERIOD? 30 DAYS? WELL, THE AD THE ADVERTISEMENT APPEARS, UH, TWO TIMES.
IT STARTS TWO WEEKS BEFORE IT, SO IT'D BE 14 DAYS BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING.
IS WHEN THE AD WOULD FIRST APPEAR AND WHEN THE SIGN, THE PROPERTY WOULD HAVE TO BE POSTED.
SO BASICALLY TWO WEEKS BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING.
UM, I MEAN, I, I'LL WEIGH IN QUICKLY SINCE I'VE ALREADY STARTED TALKING.
I, I BELIEVE IT SHOULD BE THERE AT LEAST A MINIMUM OF 30 DAYS BEFORE THE COMMISSIONS MEETING AND GIVE EVERYBODY A MONTH.
UH, DO YOU FEEL THAT'S AMPLE TIME FOR Y'ALL? REALLY? I WOULD SUBMIT OR ASK YOU TO GIVE US A TIME THAT YOU THOUGHT WAS PROPER BECAUSE YOU'RE THE ONE THAT HAS TO REVIEW THIS STUFF AND ARE GONNA HAVE A GOOD FEELING OF WHETHER IT'S GONNA GO WELL OR THAT PERSON MAY WANT TO REEVALUATE WHAT'S GOING ON IN THEIR LIFE, UH, BEFORE PUTTING IT IN.
BUT I WOULD SAY A MINIMUM OF 30 DAYS, UH, UNLESS Y'ALL HAVE A DIFFERENT NUMBER.
BRAD AND I HAVEN'T HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT IT BETWEEN OURSELVES.
UM, MYSELF, I'VE LOOKED AT IT.
UM, YEAH, I I HAD AT LEAST 21 DAYS.
30 WOULD BE EVEN BETTER FOR STAFF FOR US AND FOR THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE TO REVIEW.
UH, I AGREE WITH HU I APPRECIATE 30 DAYS.
I DON'T THINK THAT'S A LOT TO ASK.
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NOT AT ALL THOUGH.I NOT, NOT A WHOLE LOT TO ASK.
UM, AND THIS IS NOT ME BEING NEGATIVE ON THAT.
I'M JUST TELLING YOU THAT THERE'LL BE DEVELOPERS THAT WILL RAISE ONLY A CANE ON THAT ONE.
THAT'S PROBABLY, THAT'S THEIR PROBLEM.
NOT OUR, YOU KNOW, BUT WE NEED WHAT WE NEED BEFORE GOING INTO THE PUBLIC HEARING.
SO 30 DAYS SHOULD BE SUFFICIENT.
IT SHOULD ALREADY HAVE THEM THERE ACTUALLY IN ACTUALITY, RIGHT? NO.
WHAT WHAT ACTUALLY HAS, HAS HAPPENED, AND Y'ALL WEIGH IN ON THIS, IS THAT, AND, AND LET ME TELL YOU A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND.
IN FACT, I WAS LOOKING THROUGH HERE 'CAUSE UH, THIS, THIS PROPHET ORDINANCE, I'VE P PLAGIARIZED A LOT OF THE LANGUAGE OUT OF AL MALL.
AND THAT IS 14, WHICH I ASSUME THEY'RE DOING THE 14 TO COINCIDE WITH THE, UH, WITH THE, UH, AD AND WITH THE, I THINK WHAT HAPPENS A LOT OF TIMES IS MARK WILL TRY TO PUSH 'EM TO HAVE THE PROFITS IN AND AT LEAST SOMETHING IN DRAFT FORM, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME.
AND, AND LET ME GO BACK TO THE LEGALITIES.
UM, WE REALLY SHOULD HAVE SOMETHING IN DRAFT, IN, IN DRAFT FORM BY THE TIME, AND AGAIN, I'M NOT ADVOCATING, I'M JUST TELLING YOU LEGALLY, SO THE PUBLIC CAN SEE AT LEAST A DRAFT OF WHAT'S GOING ON.
THERE'S NOTHING IN THE VIRGINIA CODE THAT SAYS WHEN, UM, Y'ALL HAVE TO, IN OTHER WORDS, WHEN WE HAVE AS STAFF TO GET THE, UH, THE PROFFER DOCUMENTS, IT IS ON THE BOARD LEVEL, BUT IT'S STILL SERIOUSLY, IT'S, IT'S, THEY HAVE TO HAVE SIGNED, FINALIZED PROS PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC HEARING AT THE BOARD LEVEL AND IN THE, AND THEN THE VIRGINIA CODE'S SILENT, SILENT ON IT.
MR. CHAIRMAN, I HAD A, I HAD A QUESTION TOO.
I I, I FEEL LIKE SOME OF THIS STUFF HAS BEEN KIND OF HALF BAKED WHEN WE GET TO US AND SOMETIMES THEY'RE SHOWING UP RIGHT.
SO, UM, I TOO HAD TO COMMENT ABOUT PUBLIC INVOLVEMENT.
BUT IF 30 DAYS SOUNDS GOOD TO ME TOO.
I HAD A RELATED QUESTION AND I APOLOGIZE.
IT, IT'S KIND OF RELATED TO THE CASE YOU WERE SPEAKING OF.
UM, AND I MISSED, I THINK I MISSED MORE MEETINGS THIS YEAR THAN I'VE EVER MISSED IN MY ENTIRE TIME.
I'VE APOLOGIZED TO ALVIN NUMEROUS TIMES,
DO WE HAVE A, UM, DO WE HAVE A A, A SET, UH, RULES ON WHAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE, UM, PRESENTED IN A RESOUND? BECAUSE I FELT LIKE THIS WAS A REALLY HALF, I MEAN, I EVEN TOLD THE APPLICANT WAS, I USED THE TERM HALF BEGGED AND I JUST, I I, I TOLD HIM I DIDN'T WANT HIM TO HAVE TO SPEND $2 MILLION ON SOME, YOU KNOW, SOME KIND OF APPLICATION.
I THOUGHT THAT WAS EXCESSIVE, BUT JUST COMING IN WITH NOTHING AT ALL.
I DIDN'T PARTICULARLY CARE FOR IT EITHER.
I DIDN'T, I JUST COULDN'T REMEMBER DO WE HAVE SOMETHING SET ON THAT? IT'S KIND OF RELATED TO THIS TOPIC.
WE, WE DON'T, UM, OTHER THAN WHAT'S IN THE APPLICATION.
AND AS LONG AS THEY COMPLETE THE, THAT REZONING APPLICATION, I, I WOULD SUGGEST TO MY COLLEAGUES AND, AND YOU ALL TOO, THAT MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE WE SPENT A LOT OF TIME ON THAT AND IT WAS JUST PULLING STUFF OUT THE WHOLE TIME.
AND AGAIN, IT SHOULDN'T BE EXCESSIVE.
SOMEBODY SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PAY AN ARM AND A LEG TO HAVE TO, TO MAKE AN APPLICATION.
BUT I JUST DIDN'T FEEL LIKE THAT PARTICULAR ONE HAD ANYTHING THAT WE COULD REALLY TALK ABOUT WHEN IT FIRST CAME.
AND IT, I WOULD MAKE IT EVEN EASIER THAN THAT.
IT'S NOT, IN MY OPINION, IT'S NOT OUR JOB TO PULL THAT INFORMATION OUT.
IF THEY DON'T BRING THAT INFORMATION, THEN YOU JUST SAY, THIS ISN'T WHAT WE WANT TO SEE.
AND THEY CAN, THEY CAN GO AND TRY TO FIGURE IT OUT AT THAT POINT.
BECAUSE I, I JUST THINK IT'S WRONG.
IF I WANT TO DO SOMETHING IN THIS COUNTY, I KNOW AHEAD OF TIME WHAT I WANT TO DO AND HOW, HOW FAR I'M WILLING TO GO WOULD I DO.
ESPECIALLY IF I COME IN AND I SEE MARK, WELL, BEFORE I SUBMIT MY APPLICATION, IF I WERE TO COME IN TOMORROW AND SAY, OKAY MARK, I'M REALLY THINKING ABOUT PUTTING A LITTLE SUBDIVISION DOWN HERE AT, UH, ON MY PROPERTY IN SUTHERLAND.
AND I KNOW WE DON'T HAVE WATER AND SEWER DOWN THERE, THAT I'M GONNA HAVE TO WORK OUT SOMETHING WELL, IN SEPTIC WISE AND SPECIAL, MAYBE SPECIAL DRAIN FIELDS.
I FEEL LIKE MARK'S GONNA TELL ME SOME OF THE THINGS HE FEELS LIKE WOULD BE NECESSARY FOR ME TO HAVE.
AND BEFORE I SUBMIT, I SHOULD BE EITHER WILLING TO DO THOSE THINGS OR I'M JUST GONNA SAY, NOPE, THE COUNTY'S ASKING TOO MUCH.
BUT FOR THEM TO COME HERE AND THEN WE HAVE TO JUST SPEND HOURS UPON HOURS.
I MEAN, Y'ALL TABLED THAT WHOLE THING AND STILL HAD PROBLEMS THE SECOND
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TIME.THAT'S NOT OUR JOB TO SIT THERE AND, AND DO HIS JOB FOR HIM.
HE NEEDS TO HAVE IT DONE BEFORE HE GETS HERE.
AND I THINK THAT'S SO NECESSARY JUST TO KEEP FROM WASTING OUR TIME AND ANYBODY ELSE'S TIME.
WELL, AND YOU JUST REMINDED ME OF ANOTHER CASE DOWN WAS TOWARD MY WAY WITH A SUBDIVISION.
UH, I THINK THE APPLICANT FAILED TO COME TO OUR MEETING TWICE AND I WAS THE CHAIRMAN THAT YEAR AND I WAS AT THE BOARD MEETING AND THEY DIDN'T EVEN COME TO THE BOARD MEETING EITHER, YOU KNOW? RIGHT.
I MEAN, I THINK THAT, I THINK THE APPLICANT SHOULD, UNLESS IT'S SOME, UNLESS THEY'RE OUTTA STATE OR SOMETHING TO REPRESENTED BY A LOCAL ATTORNEY.
BUT IF THEY'RE LOCAL, WHY NOT SHOW UP? I, I TOLD THAT GENTLEMAN I WOULD NOT, YEAH.
I WOULD NOT VOTE IN ANY OTHER CASE UNLESS HE COMES.
AND, AND I WOULD ASK WHEN WE, IF WE SAID 30 DAYS AND DECIDED UPON THAT, WHY WOULD THAT MAKE 'EM MAD? THEY'VE ALREADY TALKED TO YOU PRIOR TO SUBMITTING THE APPLICATION.
THEY OUGHT TO HAVE A PRETTY GOOD IDEA OF WHAT THE COUNTY LOOKS FOR BY THE TIME THEY DO THAT.
AND I THINK IT SHOULD BE RELEVANT THAT ONCE THEY SUBMIT ALL THAT, THEN WE GET READY TO ADVERTISE IT WITHIN 30 DAYS OF OUR MEETING.
EVERYTHING SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE.
YOU WANT ME TO ASK THAT YOU IF YOU HAVE A THOUGHT.
YEAH, I, I COULDN'T TELL YOU WHY IT DOES
I, I UNDERSTAND THIS COMMENT AND TELL 'EM WHAT TO DO.
AND IT'S LIKE PULLING TEETH SOMETIMES TO GET THESE DOCUMENTS OUT OF THEM.
AND WHEN DEVELOPERS DON'T, IT'S NOT EASY FOR THEM.
AND THAT'S JAMES CITY COUNTY HAD STRICT RULE.
IN YOUR RURAL SECTORS, THE RURAL COUNTIES, VERY FEW OF THE RURAL COUNTIES HAVE RULES ABOUT THIS STUFF.
BUT IF YOU GO IN THIS ONE CASE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, I THINK THE ATTORNEY IS ON CHESTERFIELD'S MM-HMM
HE KNOW DON WELL, WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF THE CASE THAT CAME BEFORE Y'ALL, WHAT WOULD HAPPEN TO IT IN CHESTERFIELD? AND I'M GOING BACK TO JAMES CHAN DAYS.
IF, IF IT'S, WHAT IF MR. TITUS WAS SAYING IN JAMES CITY COUNTY, IF IT WASN'T LOCKED DOWN BY THE TIME IT GOT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION, THEY'D SAID FINE DOWN.
AND PEOPLE GOT TO KNOWING THAT AND EVERYTHING TOO.
SO, SO ANYWAY, SO THIS IS A GROWTH.
WHEN I FIRST GOT HERE, THE FIRST ZONING CASE I CAME INTO BE BACK WHAT? IN 2004 OR THREE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
BUT, BUT ANYWAY, IT WAS JUST A BLANKET REZONING, I MEAN THAT TYPE OF THING.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME? AND I'M TALKING ABOUT COUNTY'S PROCESSES MORE MATURING.
'CAUSE AT THAT TIME, PEOPLE JUST CAME IN HERE AND REZONED STUFF WITH NO PLANS.
AND SO YOU CALLED IN KIND OF BETWEEN.
SO THE GENTLEMAN IS PROBABLY USED, MAYBE NOT.
THERE HAVE SOME DEVELOPERS THAT USED TO GO INTO RURAL COUNTIES AND NOT BEING ASKED TO DO ANYTHING.
SO, SO ANYWAY, SO THEY GET A LITTLE GRUMBLY WHEN THEY HAVE TO ADHERE TO IT.
YOU KNOW, BUT, AND LET ME GO BACK TO THE 30 DAYS THING, 'CAUSE WE HAVE TO GO BACK AND FORTH.
WHAT HAD HAPPENED IS THAT THE PROPHETS WILL COME INTO MARK, MARK WILL BRING 'EM TO ME, I'LL REVIEW 'EM AND, AND SAY, MAN, THIS IS NOT EVEN ADEQUATE OR WHATEVER.
SO IT'S USUALLY I REVIEW IT, GET BACK TO MARK, MARK HAS TO GET, SO IT'S A BACK AND FORTH.
AND SO WHAT ABOUT 30 DAYS TO HAVE DRAFT PROFITS IN AND 14 DAYS TO HAVE 'EM FINAL, FINAL EDITS THAT THAT'LL BE, I I LIKE THAT IDEA BECAUSE THEN, THEN ALL YOU'RE ASKING IS LIKE, LOOK, PUT, PUT DOWN YOUR, YOUR IDEA, YOUR, YOU UNDERSTAND ME, YOUR ROUGH DRAFT.
THAT'LL GET THE CONVERSATION STARTED ABOUT WHETHER THE PROFITS ARE ADEQUATE ENOUGH WITH STAFF 30 DAYS AHEAD AND THEN GIVES 'EM TWO WEEKS TO KIND OF FINALIZE IT OUT.
SO BY THE TIME THE AD COMES OUT, THEY'VE GOT IT, GOT IT FINALIZED.
'CAUSE IT WON'T, MOST OF THE TIME WHEN THEY FIRST SUBMIT A PROFIT, IT'S NOT UNLESS THEY HAVE AN ATTORNEY.
UM, JUST MY SUGGESTION ON THAT, UH, LET ME, LET ME ASK YOU A QUESTION AND I'M GONNA REFER TO UM, RECENT CASE THAT WE HAD.
UM, THE ONE WHERE WE TABLED THE PROFFER SO THAT THE GUY COULD WRITE THE PROFFER CORRECTLY AND HE STILL DIDN'T DO IT.
HOW THEN, IF YOU'RE GONNA DO 30 DAYS AND FINAL THING AT 14, HOW WILL WE MAKE SURE THAT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WE LIKE TO SEE ARE INCLUDED? KATE? AND THIS IS WHY I'M USING THIS CASE
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BECAUSE HIS PROS BASICALLY SAID NOTHING ABOUT A TURN LANE.WHEN HE FIRST CAME TO US, HE SAID NOTHING ABOUT A TURN LANE.
AND SO WE BROUGHT THE ISSUE UP AND IT WAS ALMOST LIKE, Y'ALL DON'T ASK ME FOR NOTHING, JUST APPROVE WHAT I'M GIVING YOU.
AND WE FOUND ONCE WE FOUND, ONCE THEY FOUND OUT WE WASN'T JUST BLANKETLY APPROVING ANYTHING, THEN THEY WENT BACK AND TRIED TO, I DON'T KNOW, DIDN'T TRY HARD, BUT TRIED TO DO SOMETHING.
SO WHAT MY, MY QUESTION IS, IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS THERE'S SOME THINGS THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE IN THE PROFFERS THAT ARE NOT THERE.
AND I KNOW, I KNOW MR. JURY THAT THE LAW FORBIDS US TO TELL THEM WHAT TO PUT IN THE PROFFER.
I KNOW THAT, UH, WE CAN HIGHLY SUGGEST, BUT YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE JUST REFUSE TO READ BETWEEN THE LINES.
SO WHAT DO WE DO? HOW DO WE DEAL WITH THAT? I, THE WAY I'VE SEEN IT IN OF LOCALITIES, IT KIND OF GOES BACK TO WHAT MR. TUS IS SAYING.
STAFF, STAFF DOES SUGGEST THESE THINGS.
YEAH, THEY'RE TALKING TO ME AND, AND WE WON'T GET TOO MUCH INTO THE DETAIL 'CAUSE WE DON'T NEED TO, BUT THERE WERE THINGS THAT, THAT, UH, BRAD SUGGESTED THAT NEVER GOT IN THERE.
AND SO, SO WHERE IT HAPPENS IN OTHER LOCALITIES, 'CAUSE WE CAN'T SAY, IF YOU DON'T PUT THAT IN THERE, WE'RE GONNA TURN IT DOWN.
WE CAN HIGHLY SUGGEST THAT THESE WILL BE SOME CONCERNS.
AND SO WHAT WILL HAPPEN IS THEY'LL SUBMIT PROFITS AND THEN THE STAFF, I'LL LOOK AT IT AGAIN LEGALLY, AND THEN STAFF WILL BE TALKING BACK AND YOU REALLY NEED TO CONSIDER X, Y, Z.
AND SO AT THE 14 DAYS, WHAT I'M GETTING AT IS THAT IT'S LOCKED DOWN.
THIS IS WHAT YOU'RE PRESENTING TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
THEN IT GOES BACK TO THE MR. TITUS TEST, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME, WHETHER Y'ALL WANT TO DICKER WITH THESE PEOPLE OR NOT.
WHAT I'VE SEEN IN OTHER LOCALITIES IS ONCE THAT MESSAGE GETS OUT THAT YOU DON'T, IT, IT STARTS CLEANING UP THE, OKAY.
BUT THEY DO, STAFF HAS A LOT OF CONVERSATION THAT HAS GONE ON SERIOUSLY.
I, I, I AND, AND, AND FRUSTRATION THAT
SO, YOU KNOW, WELL THIS, THIS PROCESS THEN HELP STAFF AS WELL GOING FORWARD TO, UH, YEAH, I'M OFF.
SO, SO I'M ASSUMING IF WE DO IT LIKE YOU JUST TALKED ABOUT 30 DAYS A ROUGH DRAFT, 14, THEN THERE WOULD BE SOME WORDAGE THAT WOULD HAVE TO CHANGE IN HERE TO MAKE THOSE, I MEAN, BECAUSE WE JUST HAVE THE FINAL YEAH.
I, I JUST, I WROTE THIS DOCUMENT UP TO GET THE CONVERSATION STARTED.
SO, SO THAT MAKES, THAT MAKES OUR, THAT MAKES MY JOB EVEN EASIER.
SOMETIMES AT HOME WHEN I DO THAT TO GET THE CONVERSATION STARTED, IT DOESN'T WORK OUT AS WELL.
SO SINCE THE LAST TIME I SAW YOU, I SAW YOUR, UH, TV INTERVIEW.
YOU GOT THE MESSAGE OUT THERE.
WHICH, WHICH MESS?
UH, YOU ALSO HAVE A SLOT BEFORE THE, THE BOARD'S PUBLIC HEARING.
IS THAT ONE THAT WOULD, YOU COULD JUST GO WITH THE 14 DAYS BECAUSE THEY'VE ALREADY HEARD FROM US THAT WE DIDN'T LIKE SOMETHING OR WE'VE EITHER SAID NO.
AND BY THAT THEY OUGHT TO HAVE GOTTEN AN IDEA.
WOULD YOU LIKE TO CONTINUE WITH THE SAME PROCESS PRIOR TO THE BOARD? I, I THINK IT'S, DON'T Y'ALL THINK 14 DAYS WILL BE FINE WITH THAT? WITH THE BOARD? YEAH.
OH GOSH, THAT WOULD BE SO MUCH BETTER THAN THAT.
AND THAT WILL COINCIDE WITH THE AD.
NO, I THINK 14 IS FINE THAT I REALLY HAVEN'T DISCUSSED WITH STAFF, BUT I'M OKAY WITH THAT.
IF Y'ALL, SO WE'LL, WE'LL VOTE ON THIS AT OUR NEXT MEETING, CORRECT? YES.
IF YOU ALL ARE WILLING TO GO FORWARD WITH IT.
YEAH, WE WOULD, WE WOULD ADVERTISE IT FOR PUBLIC HEARING AT YOUR NOVEMBER MEETING.
SO, SO DID I JUST HEAR YOU SAY 14 DAYS IN NUMBER ONE AND TWO? UH, YEAH.
FOR THE DAYS BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING, BUT THERE WOULD BE
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ANOTHER SENTENCE THAT SAID A ROUGH DRAFT 30 DAYS BEFORE IT CAME TO US AS PUBLIC HEARING.BUT A, A FINALIZED 14 DAYS BEFORE WE TO BOTH, BEFORE WEEK COMES TO US.
IF THAT'S WHAT THEY WANT, IF WILLING TO DO NOW, IF THEY DON'T, JUST ONE MORE QUESTION.
I WAS LOOKING AT YOUR, YOUR, UM, SMALL WRITING YOU GOT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE.
IT IS ON THE, ON THE FOOTNOTE.
UM, I THINK THAT, I THINK THAT SHOULD BE INCLUDED.
NUMBER ONE SHOULD BE INCLUDED.
UM, AS IN IT WON'T BE PLACED ON THE AGENDA.
JUST DON'T PUT IT ON THE AGENDA IF YOU ADVERTISE IT AND THEN YOU HAVE TO ADVERTISE 14 DAYS OUT.
WELL IT, WHEN IT 14 DAYS AHEAD, Y'ALL WERE SUBMITTING IT TO THE PAPER.
PROBABLY WHAT? USUALLY TYPICALLY FIVE DAYS BEFORE THAT.
OH, SO YOU, I THERE COULD BE AN INSTANCE WHICH THEY'VE RELEASED THE AD 19 DAYS OUT AND APPLICANT DOESN'T ADHERE TO THE 14 DAYS AND YOU COULD HAVE A DOUBLE ADVERTISEMENT.
HOW DOES THAT AFFECT THE, THE SECOND PART OF THAT WITH THE BOARD MEETING, IF NORMALLY YOU'D SIT, WE TELL PEOPLE HERE THAT IT'S LIKE NOW IT'S OCTOBER.
YOU SAY, OKAY, IT'S GONNA BE IN NOVEMBER, BUT YOU REALLY CAN'T SAY THAT NOW.
YOU CAN SAY THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GONNA SCHEDULE IT.
YOU JUST GOTTA ADHERE TO THE, UH, TO THIS BECAUSE I MEAN, ALMOST 30 DAYS WHEN YOU WALK OUTTA HERE.
AND THAT'S WHAT, AND WHEN WE WERE TALKING, I WAS THINKING ABOUT THAT TOO.
AND I'M PROBABLY, I ONLY MIX THE CONVERSATION UP, BUT IN ACTUALITY, EVEN AT THE BOARD LEVEL WITH 14 DAYS FINAL, YOU, YOU'LL, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE THAT 30 DAY WINDOW TWO 'CAUSE THEY WALK OUTTA HERE.
TO UNDERSTAND ME AND UH, AND GO, BUT YES, IT WOULD APPLY.
IN OTHER WORDS, BASICALLY WITH THE 14 DAYS DEADLINE, YOU CAN TRIGGER THE AD.
LOOK, WE HAD THAT, THAT LAST CASE THAT JUST CAME THROUGH HERE AND RIGHT NOW THE VIRGINIA CODE IS, IS, IS SO AMBIGUOUS.
THE LEGISLATURE SAID THEY IMPROVED IT
THAT IF WE, IF WE TABLE SOMETHING NOW CONSERVATIVELY, WE HAVE TO RE ADVERTISE.
YOU JUST NOT HAVE TO DO THAT IF WE TABLE IT MM-HMM
AND IT'S NOT Y'ALL FAULT, BUT WHAT IF THE APPLICANT TABLES SAME THING.
THEN THEY SHOULD HAVE TO PAY FOR THE ADVERTISEMENT UNDER UNDERSTOOD.
WE'LL HAVE TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THAT.
I THINK THEY'RE GONNA FIX IT IN THE COMING YEAR.
BUT WHAT THEY DID IS THEY SAID THAT YOU HAVE TO ADVERTISE IT, UH, SO MANY DAYS BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING, I THINK IS WHAT IT WAS.
SO, SO IT LEFT IT AMBIGUOUS THAT IF YOU HAVE A CONTINUED PUBLIC HEARING, DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME? THAT THEN YOU GOTTA RE YOU GOTTA RE ADVERTISE.
AND SO WE'RE TAKING THE CONSERVATIVE APPROACH ON THAT.
SO IT USED TO NOT BE THAT WAY.
IF YOU ADVERTISE ONE TIME, YOU CAN CONTINUE TO PUBLIC HEARING AND NOT HAVE TO RE ADVERTISE.
SO WE, WE AS STAFF CAN TALK ABOUT THAT, HOW TO DO THAT MM-HMM
BECAUSE THAT MAY NOT BE IN THIS ORDINANCE, IT MIGHT HAVE TO BE IN THE FEE.
THAT WAS JUST A FOOTNOTE TO LET STAFF KNOW THAT I WAS THINKING ABOUT THAT IF IT HAPPENED, THAT WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT IT TOO.
SO WHAT I'M HEARING IS Y'ALL WANT US TO ALSO LOOK IN IF THE APPLICANT MISSES THE DEADLINE THAT THEY HAVE TO PAY ANOTHER ADVERTISING FEE.
ESPECIALLY IF IT'S THEIR FAULT.
IF THEY, IF IT'S THERE THE REASON THAT IT'S DELAYED OR WHATEVER, THEN THEY SHOULD HAVE TO SUFFERED THE CONSEQUENCES.
WHY SHOULD THE COUNTY SUFFER THE CONSEQUENCES? THEY SUFFER THAT.
IF THEY KNOW THEY GOTTA PAY UP FRONT, THEN THEY'LL REALIZE WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THIS IS RIGHT BEFORE WE WANT IT TO GO TO PUBLIC HEARING.
HOW MUCH IS THE ADVERTISING FEE NOW? DO WE CHARGE THE APPLICANT OR IS THAT PART OF THE 1500, 1,500 FOR THAT? OH YEAH, THAT, YEAH.
I'LL, I'LL GET IN IT ON SCHEDULE.
[00:30:01]
BUT HOW MUCH, HOW MUCH IS IT? AND WE, WE CAN TALK ABOUT THIS LATER, BUT THE 1500 IS KIND OF EVERYTHING.YOU CAN'T, WHAT I'M SAYING IS THE VIRGINIA CODE SAYS YOU CAN'T MAKE MONEY OFF THE FEES.
AND SO WE MAY HAVE TO GO BACK IN THERE.
IN OTHER WORDS, AT THE 1500 IS THE UPFRONT FEE.
WE MAY HAVE TO SAY IF IT'S READVERTISED, I I, THE PAPER WOULD CHARGE MAYBE FIVE OR 600.
IN OTHER WORDS, IT MIGHT BE A RE-ADVERTISING FEE THAT'S DIFFERENT, THAT'S LESS.
BUT WOULD IT BE, WOULD OUR STAFF IS GOING TO HAVE TO DO MORE LEGWORK TO GET IT BACK OUT THERE? WE, WE CAN, WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT TO STAFF.
I MEAN, IF IT'S SOMETHING ELSE WE GOTTA RESEARCH.
IF THERE'S SOMETHING ELSE THEY WANT US TO LOOK AT AND WHY IT'S TABLED, THEN SEND ANIMAL CONTROL LIKE THAT TO 'EM.
HEY, THEY SHOULD PAY EVERYTHING.
BUT, BUT, BUT, BUT THIS, YOU KNOW, IF YOU RIGHT, RIGHT.
I REALIZE THAT WHAT WE ARE DOING IS A GROWING PROCESS.
COUNTY IS GROWING AND THINGS ARE CHANGING.
UM, SO IF I MISS, IF IT'S MY FAULT THAT I PAID THE ADVERTISING FEE AND IT GOT ADVERTISED AND NOT MESSED UP, IT'S MY FAULT.
SO I DON'T SEE WHY THE COUNTY SHOULD BEAR THE BURDEN OF RE-ADVERTISING.
IF MY WATER BILL, IF MY WATER BILL'S LATE AND THEY CUT IT OFF, THEY DON'T NEGOTIATE ON HOW, HOW MUCH IT'S GONNA COST ME TO PUT IT BACK ON.
IF I WANT WATER, I'M GONNA PAY IT.
AND WE, YOU KNOW, WE GOT BEAUTIFUL LAND IN THE COUNTY AND WE GOT A LOT OF UNSCRUPULOUS DEVELOPERS COMING FROM OTHER PLACES WANTING TO COME IN HERE AND THROW ANYTHING UP AND THINK WE SUPPOSED TO SAY IT'S OKAY.
AND LIKE YOU SAID, IN THAT LAST CASE, I ASKED THE LAWYER SPECIFICALLY, HE MENTIONED HE WAS ON, ON THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS IN THAT AREA.
AND I ASKED HIM SPECIFICALLY ABOUT SOME THINGS, AND I KNEW ABOUT, I KNEW ABOUT THE ANSWERS HE GAVE THAT WHAT WAS, WHAT HIS CLIENT WAS TRYING TO PUSH WOULD NOT WORK OVER THERE.
IT WOULD NOT GO, THEY'D HAVE SHUT HIM DOWN LONG TIME AGO.
LISTEN, DON'T PLAY ME FOR NO DUMMY DUMB, BUT I AIN'T THAT DUMB.
I SEE TOO OFTEN HERE, THE LATENESS OF GETTING PROFITS TO PLANNING DOESN'T ALLOW PLANNERS HAVE TO COME IN HERE AND, AND A NOT NOT TO THEIR FAULT, BUT HAVE BEEN PRESENTED DETAIL IN NOT ADEQUATE TIME TO THOROUGHLY THINK IT THROUGH.
SO THAT SHOULD HELP, THAT SHOULD HELP US A WHOLE LOT.
SHOULD, BECAUSE I, THE REASON THEY DO THAT IS SO YOU DO MISS SOMETHING.
I HAVE TO SAY, WITH ANY OF THESE KIND OF ADMINISTRATIVE, UH, PROCEDURES THAT WE HAVE IN OUR DIFFERENT ORDINANCES, IT'S DEFINITELY A BALANCING ACT BECAUSE BRAD AND I WILL SEE, YOU KNOW, UH, AN APPLICANT WHO HAS AN ATTORNEY.
UM, THEY, THEY'VE GONE THROUGH THE PROCESS BEFORE IN OTHER PLACES.
THEY'RE FAMILIAR WITH PROFFERS, WHAT THEY ARE, THE DETAILS THAT THEY'RE VOLUNTARY, ALL THAT.
UM, SO IT'S A DEFINITE BALANCING ACT DEPENDING ON, YOU KNOW, WHO THE APPLICANT IS.
WE HAVE SOME APPLICANTS THAT JUST MAY WANT TO REZONE THEIR PROPERTY.
THEY HA YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY JUST HAPPEN TO HAVE, UM, SOMETHING THAT THEY MAY EVEN WANT TO DO WITH THEIR PROPERTY THAT REQUIRES A REZONING OR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT.
AND, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE NEVER GONE THROUGH THE PROCESS.
SO IT'S DEFINITELY A BALANCING ACT AND IT'S GOOD CONVERSATION THAT WE'RE HAVING BECAUSE SOMETIMES IT, YOU COULD GET A LITTLE TOO STRICT, YOU KNOW, WITH SOME OF THE DEADLINES WHERE, YOU KNOW, UM, JUST A INDIVIDUAL PROPERTY OWNER WHO ONLY WANTS, YOU KNOW, HAS TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS MAYBE ONE TIME ON THEIR PROPERTY.
UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S TOUGH FOR BRAD AND MYSELF SOMETIMES WORKING WITH DIFFERENT APPLICANTS DEPENDING ON HOW, YOU KNOW, FAMILIAR THEY ARE WITH THE ZONING CODE PROCEDURES THAT WE HAVE, DEADLINES THAT WE HAVE, THOSE KIND OF THINGS.
SO IT'S, IT'S GOOD FOR CONVERSATION THAT WE'RE HAVING.
[00:35:01]
A BALANCING ACT, UM, WITH HOW WE WANT TO BE WITH OUR ADMINISTRATIVE PROCEDURE.WELL, I THINK Y'ALL ARE DOING A GOOD JOB, EVEN THOUGH SOMETIME I THINK YOU'RE HANDICAPPED AND WE DON'T ADD, WE ADD A LOT OF PRESSURE TO THAT.
I THINK Y'ALL DO A WONDERFUL JOB.
BUT I, I THINK MIKE MADE A GOOD POINT ABOUT, UM, STAFF, WHEN WE DO MEET WITH AN APPLICANT, WE DO TRY TO SUGGEST CERTAIN THINGS AND WE OFTEN REFER BACK TO OTHER CASES THAT, THAT WE'VE SEEN THAT ARE SIMILAR TO A CASE THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE BRINGING AND TELL 'EM THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT, AND THEY, A LOT OF TIMES THEY'LL ASK US TO, WHAT ARE THE TYPES OF THINGS YOU ALL WANT TO SEE? DO YOU, DO YOU WANT THEM TO, UM, SUBMIT PROFFERS? UM, DO YOU WANT CONCEPT PLANS? THOSE KIND OF THINGS.
SO THERE IS A LOT OF BACK AND FORTH AS, AS MIKE INDICATED GOING THROUGH THE, THE APPLICATION PROCESS.
I I, THIS MAY NOT BE TOTALLY RELATED TO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, BUT WHEN THEY COME IN TO HAVE A REZONING, IS THERE ANY KIND OF WAY THAT WE COULD GET AN IDEA OF WHAT THEY'RE PLANNING TO DO WITH THE PROPERTY? UM, ARE, ARE YOU SPEAKING FROM A, LIKE, I GUESS YOU'RE KIND OF REFERRING TO WHAT, WHAT MIKE WAS TALKING ABOUT, WHERE THE, LIKE WHEN THEY WANT TO COME IN AND JUST SAY THEY WANT TO REZONE THE PROPERTY AND THEY DON'T HAVE ANY SPECIFIC USE IN MIND, OR NOT QUITE SURE.
I WOULDN'T, I WON'T GO SO FAR AS THEY DON'T HAVE, THEY DON'T HAVE A SPECIFIC USE IN MIND.
BUT THEY HAVE AN IDEA WHAT THEY WANNA DO WITH THE PROPERTY, THE REASON THEY WANNA REZONE IT, BUT THAT WHAT THEY PLAN TO DO WITH IT IS HID FROM US.
AND SO WE ARE ASKED TO REZONE A PIECE OF PROPERTY JUST BLINDLY WITHOUT HAVING AN IDEA OR A CLUE OF WHAT THEY'RE GONNA PUT ON IT.
AND, AND MY REASON FOR, MY REASON FOR THAT IS WE HAD A CASE NOT TOO LONG AGO HU
UH, MINI STORAGE, MINI STORAGE, MINI STORAGE.
MINI MINI STORAGE, SELF SERVICE STORAGE FACILITY.
BUT THEY WANTED, THEY WANTED TO REZONE THE PROPERTY.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IF SOMEBODY COMES IN AND WANNA REZONE THEIR PROPERTY AND THEY WANTED TO PUT A MINI STORAGE ON IT, WE GOT ENOUGH MINI STORAGES, I THINK.
UH, BUT I, SO WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT THEY WANT TO DO WITH IT, IT KIND OF ASK YOU, YOU'RE ASKING ME TO GO DUCK HUNTING AND TURNED BACKWARDS IN THE BLIND AND FIRED MY GUN.
I'M GONNA HIT THE DUCK THAT WAY.
NOW, IF YOU NON DUCK HUNTERS, THAT MEAN I'M SHOOTING AT THE BACK OF THE BLIND.
AND I THINK MIKE ALLUDED TO THAT EARLIER, THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, ANY PROPERTY OWNER CAN PETITION TO HAVE THEIR PROPERTY REZONED, PROFFERS ARE VOLUNTARY.
UM, SO IT'S, IT'S TOUGH, UM, SOMETIMES FOR STAFF AND DEFINITELY FOR YOU ALL AS WELL.
UM, DEPENDING ON THE APPLICANT AND WHAT THE APPLICANT'S PRESENTING AS PART OF THEIR APPLICATION.
AND IF THEY'RE NOT, IF THEY DON'T WANT TO DO CERTAIN THINGS RELATED TO THAT PETITION TO REQUEST TO REZONE THE PROPERTY, THEN DO YOU APPROVE IT? I I, I MEAN, I, I'LL GO AHEAD AND SIMPLIFY IT.
THERE'S, THERE'S NOTHING IN THE VIRGINIA CODE THAT SAYS STAFF CAN STOP THE APPLICATION FROM COMING TO Y'ALL.
IN THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS, IF YOU LIKE THE INFORMATION THAT'S GIVEN, GREAT.
IF YOU DON'T, A A REZONING IS NOT A, A PROPERTY, RIGHT? OH YEAH.
AND SO YOU CAN JUST SAY A LEGISLATIVE BODY CAN SAY, YEAH, YES OR NO WITH NO REASON THAT WE ARE NOT HERE TO TALK ABOUT THIS TONIGHT.
[00:40:01]
A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT THAT'S ALREADY IN THE CORRECT ZONING.SLIGHTLY, A LITTLE DIFFERENT REASON.
I DON'T QUITE LIKE CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS AS MUCH.
THEY, THEY'RE GOOD THINGS TO HAVE, BUT YOU HAVE TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF REASONING ON A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT.
BUT IT'S JUST A STRAIGHT REZONING.
AND SO, SO THAT'S, I'M NOT TRYING TO THROW IT BACK IN YOUR COURT, BUT I AM.
IN OTHER WORDS, I'M GLAD YOU DID THOUGH, BUT YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M GETTING AT.
I THAT, THAT'S Y'ALL'S RIGHT JOB.
I APPRECIATE YOU THROWING IT BACK AT ME.
I APPRECIATE THAT STAFF, APPLICANT COMES TO STAFF, STAFF TRIES TO DO WHAT THEY CAN TO BRING 'EM UP TO SPEED ON WHAT Y'ALL IN THE COUNTY MAY WANT.
THEY PRESENT WHAT THEY CAN GET 'EM TO DO AND IT KIND OF IS LO TO Y'ALL TO SAY YES OR NO.
AND SINCE WE'RE SITTING HERE AND THIS IS RECORDED, THIS IS A GOOD TIME TO SAY WHAT I WANT TO SAY ABOUT THIS.
THAT EXACT CASE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
MRS. TUCKER WAS TOLD TO US THAT IT WAS WANTED BY THE COUNTY THAT MORGAN AND OTHERS HAD TALKED TO THAT INDIVIDUAL AND HAD COME TO AN AGREEMENT ABOUT THAT SPECIFIC PIECE OF PROPERTY.
I THINK THAT'S JUST PLAIN RUDE FOR THE COUNTY NOT TO SHOW UP AND SAY THAT IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA TELL ME OR HAVE THE ABILITY TO TELL ME WHAT YOU WANT TO PUT THERE, YOU BETTER HAVE ONE OF YOUR FLUNKY STANDING UP HERE AND MAKING SURE THAT WE KNOW THAT IT'S IMPORTANT FOR THIS COUNTY AND THAT WE NEED TO JUST KIND OF WALK THROUGH THE PROCESS INSTEAD OF JUST BLINDLY COMING IN HERE TELLING US TO REZONE A PIECE OF PROPERTY AND THEN ALLOWING THAT INDIVIDUAL TO THROW OUT.
WELL, MORGAN AND I HAVE HAD A DISCUSSION OR TAMMY OR KEVIN OR WHOEVER IT IS, AND WE DON'T WANT TO DISCLOSE WHAT IT IS THAT'S COMING AT THIS TIME.
I UNDERSTAND THAT SOME INDUSTRIES DON'T WANT TO DISCLOSE WHAT'S COMING MM-HMM
BUT IF THE COUNTY WANTS IT, THE COUNTY NEEDS TO BE HERE TO EXPLAIN, THIS IS A PROCESS THAT WE CAN'T DIVULGE RIGHT NOW.
WE REALLY THINK IT'S SOMETHING GOOD FOR THE COUNTY.
WE NEED YOU TO REZONE THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY SO THAT IT FITS THE USE THAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR AND KIND OF GIVE US A LITTLE BIT OF COMMON COURTESY INSTEAD OF JUST PULLING THE WOOL OVER OUR EYES AND SAY, DO WHAT WE TELL YOU OR THAT PERSON TELLS YOU AND NOT HAVE ANY INFORMATION WHATSOEVER.
WHICH PARCEL WAS THIS? OVER BEHIND, UH, RON'S MUFFLER WHERE MM-HMM
ROSALYN FARMS WANTED TO REZONE OR CHANGE SOME OF THE B ONE OR B TWO, WHICHEVER ONE IT WAS TO M TWO.
AND WE HAD THE WHOLE CONVERSATION ABOUT MANY STORAGE, AND I ASKED, WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO EXCLUDE MANY STORAGE? BECAUSE IF YOU'RE GONNA CHANGE IT TO INDUSTRIAL, I MEAN, AND YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT MANUFACTURING MINI STORAGE IS NOT AN ISSUE FOR YOU.
UH, BUT THEY WOULDN'T SAY ANYTHING.
AND THEY SAID, MORGAN AND I HAVE BEEN TALKING AND KEVIN, AND THIS IS ALL PART OF THE COUNTY'S PLAN.
NOBODY FROM THE COUNTY'S HERE COME TELL US ABOUT A PLAN, BUT THEY WANT US TO DO SOMETHING.
AND I THINK THAT'S RUDE TO DO THAT.
WELL, I, I APOLOGIZE I MISSED THAT ONE.
BUT I I DID, WHEN, WHEN I ASKED ABOUT WHAT WAS COMING UP, I WAS UNDER THE IMPRESSION THERE WAS MORE INDUSTRIAL THERE.
I WOULD'VE NEVER GUESSED IT WAS MINI STORAGE.
I DON'T KNOW THAT MINI STORAGE IS GOING ON THAT.
BUT THEY WANTED IT SO A MANUFACTURER COULD COME.
YOU HAVEN'T TOLD US WHAT MANUFACTURER, AND WE WORK UNDER THE SAME RULES THEY DO IF WE'RE TOLD SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO KEEP QUIET, DO THEY THINK WE CAN'T KEEP QUIET? DO THEY THINK WE'RE KINDERGARTNERS? SO YOU ARE USING THE MINI STORAGE BECAUSE IT'S A BUY RIGHT FOR THEM TOO? YES.
I, I UNDERSTAND IT IS I UNDERSTAND THAT.
AND IT'S NOT CONDITIONAL USE LIKE IT IS IN B ONE TWO OR B TWO.
B2, LIKE B ONES WE HAD TO DEAL WITH AND ALL THAT.
SO WE HAVE NO SAY ABOUT ANYTHING.
NO, I I UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT.
I, I, I'M GONNA GO BACK TO, UM, AND STAFF MAY KNOW MORE ABOUT THAT SITUATION THAN, THAN I DO.
UM, I, I GOT THE, IT, IT WAS MY TUITION THAT BASICALLY THAT THEY WANTED TO MARKET IT AT A HIGHER LEVEL TO DIFFERENT CLIENTS.
I'M NOT SURE THERE IS A CLIENT, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME, UM, THERE, BUT, BUT WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY IS THAT
[00:45:01]
IF THEY DON'T PUT WHAT Y'ALL WANT TO SEE IN THE PROFITS AND RESTRICT IT, JUST AGAIN, JUST VOTE NO.SO THAT'S WHAT WE'LL DO NEXT TIME.
BECAUSE, WELL, MS. TITMUS, YOU DID VOTE NO ON THAT ONE.
I DID
'CAUSE I WASN'T ABLE TO BE HERE THAT EVENING.
BUT I MEAN THAT'S, AND THAT'S THE WAY I SEE IT.
IF YOU'RE NOT WILLING TO, TO, TO MEET ME HALFWAY, WHY AM I GONNA MEET YOU ALL THE WAY? YEAH, I DON'T, AND THIS, THIS IS JUST MY PERSONAL OPINION.
WHEN Y'ALL HAD THAT CONVERSATION THAT NIGHT, WHO WAS STANDING UP HERE REPRESENTING YOUR FO UH, ROZEN FARMS, WHICH I WENT TO SCHOOL WITH HIS DAD.
BUT YOU DIDN'T HAVE THE OWNER HERE.
AND HE DID SAY A TIME OR TWO, HE KIND OF DANCED AROUND IT.
IN OTHER WORDS, HE WAS NOT, THE DECISION MAKER WASN'T HERE.
I THINK HE WOULD'VE GOTTEN MORE IF THE DECISION MAKER HAD BEEN HERE THAT EVENING.
SO THAT WAS MY POINT EARLIER ABOUT THE CASE IN, IN MC KENNY, THREE MEETINGS.
I'M SORRY TO HAVE DRUG THIS OUT IN A WHOLE DIFFERENT DIRECTION, BUT
PAY YOUR TAXES AND YOU GIVE YOUR TAX.
[5. SHORT TERM RENTALS DISCUSSION – BRAD ROBINSON, SENIOR PLANNER/ZONING ADMINISTRATOR AND MARK BASSETT, PLANNING DIRECTOR]
FIVE, SHORT TERM RENTAL DISCUSSIONS.UM, IT'S BEEN SOME TIME SINCE WE, UM, HAVE COME BACK AND TALKED TO YOU ALL ABOUT SHORT TERM RENTALS.
UH, MR. ROBINSON DID, UM, COME TO ONE OF YOUR PREVIOUS WORKSHOPS, UM, AND WE STARTED THE DISCUSSION ABOUT SHORT-TERM RENTALS THAT WE WERE LOOKING AT THAT, UM, THAT THE BOARD ASKED STAFF TO LOOK AT, UM, HOW THAT WOULD FIT INTO OUR ORDINANCE AND IF THAT'S SOMETHING THE COUNTY WANTED TO DO, UM, AT ALL TO CHANGE OUR CURRENT APPROACH, HOW WE APPROACH SHORT TERM RENTALS, WHERE THEY'RE ALLOWED, THAT TYPE OF THING.
SO, UM, BRAD AND I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YOU AN UPDATE, UM, OF WHAT WE'VE BEEN DOING KIND OF BEHIND THE SCENES ON THAT.
WE DON'T HAVE A, UM, MR. JURY HAS WORKED WITH US ON PREPARING, UM, SOME DRAFT DOCUMENTS RELATED TO SHORT TERM RENTALS.
UM, SO EVEN MIKE HAS, HAS DONE SOME RESEARCH ON ORDINANCE, UH, INCLUDING, UH, SHORT TERM RENTALS IN OUR ZONING ORDINANCE, UM, REQUIREMENTS RELATED TO THAT.
UM, SO, UM, I GUESS I'LL HAND IT OFF TO BRAD NOW, AND, UM, HE CAN KIND OF GIVE YOU A, UH, LITTLE UPDATE ABOUT SOME OTHER THINGS WE'VE BEEN DOING BEHIND THE SCENES RELATED TO THAT.
AND WE WANTED TO TRY TO JUST LIKE WE DID WITH OUR PREVIOUS, UH, AGENDA ITEM, UH, GET SOME FEEDBACK FROM YOU ALL, UH, RELATED TO SHORT TERM RENTALS AND KIND OF WHERE WE GO FROM HERE, UH, THIS EVENING.
GOOD EVENING, MR. CHAIRMAN AND MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION.
SO, UH, YOU MAY RECALL THAT WE ORIGINALLY BROACHED THIS SUBJECT, UM, LAST FALL IN A WORKSHOP WE JUST HAD.
UM, IT HAS BEEN DIFFICULT, UM, TRYING TO PREPARE ORDINANCE AMENDMENTS OVER THE LAST YEAR BECAUSE I WANTED TO MAKE YOU ALL AWARE THAT, UM, IN ADDITION TO OUR DAILY DUTIES, THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT IS IN THE MIDST OF A SOFTWARE PROJECT WHERE WE ARE IMPLEMENTING PERMITTING SOFTWARE FOR THE DEPARTMENT.
UM, ALL OF THE COUNTY HAS PURCHASED, UM, SOFTWARE TO MAKE SOME OF OUR OPERATIONS MORE DIGITAL AND MORE EFFICIENT.
AND THE, THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT IS THE LAST PHASE OF THAT.
SO WE'VE, WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THAT EFFORT SINCE LAST FALL.
UM, AND WITHIN THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTHS, THE COUNTY WILL, UM, BE IMPLEMENTING PERMITTING SOFTWARE THAT WILL ALLOW THE DEPARTMENT TO OPERATE MORE DIGITALLY, BUT ALSO WILL ALLOW SOME OF OUR CITIZENS TO BE ABLE TO APPLY FOR DIFFERENT FUNCTIONS OF THE DEPARTMENT ONLINE INSTEAD OF, INSTEAD OF HAVING TO MAKE A TRIP HERE TO THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATION BUILDING.
SO THAT PROCESS, UM, HAS TAKEN UP SOME TIME WITH STAFF OF US WORKING ON THAT IN ADDITION TO OUR DAILY DUTIES OF PERMITS COMING IN AND CASES AND, UH,
[00:50:01]
THE PHONE CALLS AND WALK-INS THAT WE RECEIVE.SO IT WAS THE INTENT TO TRY TO HAVE A, UH, A DRAFT ORDINANCE TO YOU ALL BEFORE THIS TIME, BUT BECAUSE OF OTHER, UM, PRIORITIES AND THINGS THAT WE'RE WORKING ON, THAT'S WHY WE'RE BRINGING THIS BACK TO YOU THIS EVENING.
SO I WAS GONNA PASS OUT A CHART TO YOU THAT, UM, YOU SHOULD RECALL, THIS WAS IN OUR WORKSHOP PRESENTATION LAST FALL.
I WAS GONNA DISTRIBUTE THIS TO YOU ALL.
I'M GONNA GET MR. GURLEY TO ASSIST ME.
NEED ANOTHER ONE? JUST THE LANGUAGE.
SO THIS WAS A, UM, A CHART THAT, UH, IS FROM THE PRESENTATION THAT WE HAD IN LAST FALL'S WORKSHOP.
AND THIS JUST OUTLINES HOW THE COUNTY CURRENTLY DEALS WITH, UH, RENTAL AND LODGING ACTIVITY.
WE HAVE SOME DESIGNATED USES IN THE ORDINANCE, UM, FOR LODGING TYPE OF ACTIVITY AS YOU'LL SEE ON THE PAGE.
NOW, THE USE ITSELF SHORT-TERM RENTAL, YOU WON'T FIND THAT IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
UM, CURRENTLY WE, UH, ALLOW SHORT-TERM RENTAL ACTIVITY IN THE FORM OF FARM STAY, UH, WITH AGRICULTURAL AGRITOURISM USES.
UH, SO THE, THE FARM STAY REFERENCE IS IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE AND THAT IS HOW THE COUNTY HAS APPROACHED SHORT-TERM RENTAL ACTIVITY.
BUT THEN AS YOU CAN SEE, OTHER USES SUCH AS UM, IF SOMEONE WANTED TO DO USES SUCH AS A BED AND BREAKFAST OR A CAMPGROUND, YOU ACTUALLY DEALT WITH THAT EARLY THIS YEAR, A HOTEL OR A MOTEL.
UM, ASIDE FROM A FARM STAY, THESE ARE THE OTHER, UM, OPTIONS AND ORDINANCE THAT SOMEONE WOULD HAVE.
SO WE WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR TO YOU THAT THE, THE, THE CURRENT APPROACH THAT THE COUNTY HAS WAS BASED ON SENTIMENT OF THE COUNTY OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND THE BOARD SOMETIME AGO.
SO THE WAY WE'RE CURRENTLY APPROACHING SHORT-TERM RENTALS WAS WITH, UH, INSIGHT FROM THE COUNTY.
SO THE PURPOSE OF BRINGING THIS TO YOU LAST FALL, UM, A LOT OF THE FEEDBACK WE GOT AT THAT TIME WAS POSITIVE OF WANTING TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS.
UM, BUT WE WOULD, WE JUST WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND TO THE COUNTY THAT THIS IS OUR CURRENT POLICY AND IF WE ARE LOOKING AT, UM, CHANGING IT, THAT WOULD, THAT'S THE PURPOSE OF US WANTING TO GET SOME INPUT FROM YOU.
DO WE WANT TO CHANGE THE POLICY? DO WE WANT TO KEEP IT AS IS, MAKE ADJUSTMENTS, ET CETERA.
UM, SO AS MIKE WAS UH, SAYING, OR AS MR. BASS WAS SAYING, UM, THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE WITH MR. JEWELRY, UM, WE HAVE ATTEMPTED TO START A DRAFT ORDINANCE.
WE DON'T HAVE THAT READY FOR YOU TO PRESENT TONIGHT, BUT WE ARE TRYING TO WORK ON A DRAFT ORDINANCE.
BUT WHAT WE WOULD NEED SOME FEEDBACK FROM YOU ALL IS IF WE ARE, UM, IN AGREEMENT THAT WE WANT TO EXPAND HOW WE REGULATE SHORT TERM RENTAL ACTIVITY, UM, WE WOULD LIKE SOME FEEDBACK FROM YOU ALL OF WHAT SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT THE REGULATIONS WOULD NEED TO ADDRESS AND WHAT AREAS OF THE COUNTY THAT THIS USE WOULD BE APPROPRIATE.
AND THAT'S PRIMARILY SOME OF THE FEEDBACK WE WOULD LIKE THAT WOULD HELP US TO BE ABLE TO DRAFT THE ORDINANCE.
WHERE WOULD YOU PUT AN, UH, AIRBNB PRESENTLY? WHERE WOULD IT BE PRESENTLY? UNDER, SO PRESENTLY AGRITOURISM, PRESENTLY RIGHT NOW IT'S IN ASSOCIATION WITH AGRITOURISM, WHICH IS ALLOWED BY WRIGHT IN OUR A ONE AND A TWO DISTRICTS.
NOW MOST OF THE COUNTY IS ZONED A TWO.
SO ESSENTIALLY THE A TWO DISTRICT.
OKAY, YOU CAN DO IT IN RR ZONING, WHICH IS RESIDENTIAL CONSERVATIVE, I BELIEVE.
AND THEN R ONE, WHICH IS THE LIMITED RESIDENTIAL DISTRICT.
YOU CAN DO IT IN THOSE DISTRICTS, BUT THAT'S ONLY IF THERE IS AN EXISTING AGRICULTURAL OR AGRITOURISM USE IN THAT DISTRICT.
[00:55:01]
IF THERE WAS A FARM OPERATION, EXISTING FARM OPERATION IN AN R ONE ZONED AREA THAT IS STILL CURRENTLY OPERATING, SOMEONE COULD CONDUCT AGRITOURISM ON THAT PARCEL AND HAVE A FARM STAY USED.BUT THAT IS THE ONLY WAY YOU'D BE ABLE TO DO IT IN RR AND R ONE.
IF I OWN, IF I'M IN A TWO, EXCUSE ME.
IF I'M IN A TWO, MY HOUSE IS SHOWN A ZONING AREA OF A TWO, MY HOUSE IS THERE AND I WANTED TO REUSE MY HOUSE FOR AN A, B AND B, CAN I DO THAT? THE ANSWER WOULD BE NO.
IF IT WAS JUST A RESIDENTIAL USE ON THAT PROPERTY, IT WOULD HAVE TO BE IN ASSOCIATION WITH AGRITOURISM.
YOU EVER, HOW FAR DO YOU GO WITH THAT? I MEAN, LIKE IF YOU'RE AN A TWO AND YOU GOT, UM, TIMBERLAND ISN'T THAT AGRICULTURAL MAY NOT CUT IT, BUT EVERY, SEVERAL DECADES, YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? AM I RIGHT? IT IS YOUR, IF YOU HAVE, UH, TIMBERLAND, IS YOUR PROPERTY IN LAND USE UNDER THE LAND USE PROGRAM OR JUST, JUST WELL, THIS ISN'T FOR ME, TRUST ME.
NO, I'M, I'M JUST, JUST A SCENARIO BECAUSE THAT BRAD KIND OF HAS A, LIKE A, WE HAVE NOT A POLICY, A FORMAL POLICY, BUT WE HAVE THE AGRITOURISM ORDINANCES IS, WELL THE USES ARE BASED ON, AS BRAD INDICATED, THAT YOU'RE ACTUALLY USING YOUR PROPERTY FOR SOME TYPE OF AGRICULTURAL USE CROPS.
YOU'RE GROWING TIMBER, THAT TYPE OF THING.
SO YOU USE LAND USE AS A VERY OFTEN THAT, THAT'S OUR FIRST THING WE LOOK AT IS THE PROPERTY AND LAND USE.
ARE YOU TRULY USING IT, UM, FOR TIMBER? YOU'RE SAYING LAND USE IS THEN YOU'RE NOT, IT DOESN'T QUALIFY.
'CAUSE THEN YOU'RE SAYING YOU'RE A FORMAL AGRICULTURAL.
I DIDN'T CONFUSE NO, THE ISSUE IF, IF YOU IN AN AGRICULTURAL ZONE AREA AND YOU'VE, IT'S VERY EASY, VERY EASY TO HAVE AGRITOURISM ON YOUR PROPERTY.
WELL, THAT WAS MY POINT WHEN MR. ER RAISED THAT QUESTION THAT IT MADE ME THINK THAT ANYBODY WITH A TWO COULD PRETTY MUCH DO ANYTHING.
N NO, THEY HAVE TO LOOK AT IT RIGHT NOW.
RIGHT NOW IT IS DIFFICULT BECAUSE EVERYTHING, WHAT HE'S SAYING IS THAT YOU COULD ONLY DO A SHORT TERM RENTALS IN A LANDS AND WELL BASICALLY IN CONNECTION WITH AGRITOURISM.
BUT, BUT D WHITTY COUNTY HAS A WHOLE LOT OF SMALL SUB, SMALL SIZED SUBDIVISIONS IN A LAND.
SO IF YOU COME OUT HERE AND YOU JUST GOT A HOUSE AND YOU'VE GOT SOME TIMBER BEHIND IT AND EVERYTHING, MORE THAN LIKELY, LEGALLY I'M GONNA SAY, HEY, THEY, THEY COULD BE AGRITOURISM.
IF YOU COME HERE AND YOU'RE HAVE GOT HALF OR TWO ACRE LOTS OR WHATEVER IT IS, AND IT'S JUST A HOUSE SITTING THERE, WELL, IT'S GOTTA BE SOMETHING ELSE.
AND, AND YOU CAN, THERE'S ALL TYPES OF, WE DON'T NEED TO GO INTO MECHANICS OF IT, BUT, YOU KNOW, ARE YOU FILING A AGRICULTURAL SCHEDULE IN YOUR INCOME TAX? SO WHAT THEY'RE SAYING IT IS KIND OF DIFFICULT NOW TO DIVIDING LINE OTHER THAN AGRITOURISM IS, AND AGRICULTURE IS BROADLY, IT'S COMING TO A RURAL PROPERTY AND ENJOYING THE RURAL ATMOSPHERE, RIGHT.
SO IT'S VERY EASY UNDER VIRGINIA CODE TO QUALIFY.
NEXT QUESTION I HAVE SIR, IS, UM, THANK YOU
SO, UM, IF I'M, IF I'M USING MY PROPERTY, I QUALIFY FOR AGRITOURISM, BUT I'M USING IT AS AN AIRBNB, DOES THE COUNTY GET TAX OFF OF THAT? DO YOU WANT ME TO ANSWER THAT ONE OR YOU GOT IT? I'LL LET YOU ANSWER IT, BUT I BELIEVE THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION IS YES, YOU'RE CORRECT.
THAT'S, THAT'S, AND I HAVE, I HAVE TO FILE, I HAVE TO FILE THAT, UH, WITH THE IRS AS WELL.
AM I RIGHT AS A BUS, I HAVE TO HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE TO DO THAT? YEAH, A BUSINESS LICENSE IS REQUIRED TO OPERATE
[01:00:01]
IN AIRBNB USE.LET ME, LET ME EXPLAIN A LITTLE BIT FURTHER.
'CAUSE YOU ARE GOING DOWN THE RIGHT LINE OF THINKING.
THE INTERNET HAS CREATED ALL TYPES OF BUSINESS OPPORTUNITIES THAT THE VIRGINIA CODE AND LAND USE HASN'T KEPT UP WITH.
AND EVEN TAXATION HAS NOT KEPT UP WITH, I ASKED MS. STEVENS THAT QUESTION THE OTHER DAY, JUST TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTOOD.
UM, THERE WAS A AIRBNB, UM, YOU'LL, YOU'LL, UM, INTERNET SERVICE HOSTING SITES NOW SUCH AS AIRBNB, HIP CAMP, UM, I'M TRYING TO THINK, YOU KNOW, VRBO VR, THIS TYPE OF IN DIFFERENT THINGS.
UM, THEY SUPPOSED TO AUTOMATICALLY TAKE OUT TRANSIENT OCCUPANCY TAX AND SEND IT TO THE COUNTY NOW AND WE WON'T GET INTO THIS.
SO THEN WITTY GETS A CHECK EVERY MONTH, JUST GETS A CHECK.
THERE'S NO KNOWING WHETHER WHO'S PAID WHERE, WHERE I PAY.
SO THE LAND, THE LANDOWNER DOESN'T PAY IT.
THE HOSTING, THE INTERNET HOSTING COMPANY PAYS IT TO THE COUNTY.
THEY TAKE OUT A, THEY TAKE OUT A FEE.
YOU KNOW, LET'S SAY YOU CAMP ON SOMEBODY'S PROPERTY FOR 40 BUCKS AND THEY KEEP $5 OF IT AND SEND THE OWNER 30, THAT $5 IS FULL THEIR TRANSACTIONAL FEE AND TO SEND TAX BACK TO THE COUNTY.
SO YES, IT IS TAX, BUT LAST LEGISLATIVE SESSION, I'M GETTING MY LEGISLATIVE SECTIONS MIXED UP.
THEY JUST RECENTLY PASSED WITHIN THE LAST YEAR AND A HALF, MAYBE A, TO ALLOW VIRGINIA'S THE DI'S RURAL STATE.
AND SO THEY SAID LOCALITIES CAN CREATE AND REQUIRE A REGISTRY, A REGISTRATION PROCESS, UM, AND ORDINANCE.
SO WHAT YOU'RE SEEING, AND ALL OF US SITTING HERE, BRAD AND MARK HAS BEEN IN THESE CONVERSATIONS WITH PLANNERS.
I'VE BEEN IN THESE CONVERSATIONS WITH, UM, WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENT ATTORNEYS ASSOCIATION.
THERE'S LOTS GOING ON WITH THIS NOW AND DISCUSSIONS ABOUT IT, BUT VIRGINIA DID ALLOW A REGISTRY PROCESS AT THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT LEVEL.
SO WHAT YOU SEE IS MOST OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS THAT WANT TO REGULATE THESE THINGS HAVE A REGISTRATION PROCESS.
SO THEY HAVE SOME TYPE OF IDEA OF WHO'S DOING IT AND, UH, THERE IS A FEE AND KNOW WHO NEEDS A BUSINESS LICENSE AND, AND THE, AND HAS A PENALTY IF YOU DON'T, IF YOU'RE DOING IT IN, IN STEMI AND DON'T, UM, AND DON'T AT LEAST REGISTER.
AND Y'ALL, BRAD AND MARK PROBABLY HAVE LOOKED INTO THIS MORE THAN I HAVE, BUT, UM, I'M TRYING TO THINK OF SOME OF THE COUNTIES.
OF COURSE, VIRGINIA BEACH IS A BIG ONE.
THEY'VE DEALT WITH IT A LONG TIME.
THEY'VE EVEN GOT A WHOLE, ALMOST A WHOLE DEPARTMENT THAT DEALS WITH THIS SPECIFICALLY.
UM, BUT MOST OF ALBEMARLE COUNTY I KNOW HAS GOT, GOT ONE.
AND MOST OF THEM HAVE A ORDINANCE THAT TALKS ABOUT REGISTRATION PENALTIES FOR NOT REGISTERING AND, UH, PUT SOME, TELL YOU WHERE YOU CAN DO IT, WHAT ZONING CLASSIFICATION YOU CAN DO IT.
AND, AND THEN THEY DO RESTRICT IT.
YOU UNDERSTAND ME, UM, AS FROM, FROM NOISE AND PARKING AND THIS TYPE OF THING.
SO BRAD, MAYBE I'M TAKING AWAY TOO, TOO MUCH.
BUT, UM, I HAVE LOOKED INTO THIS FOR PLANNING AS TO WHAT OTHER LOCALITIES, UH, ARE DOING.
WHAT, UH, BRAD IS TELLING YOU IS THAT DEN WITTY.
WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING RIGHT NOW.
SO YES, THEY HAVE TO EVALUATE IT, IT AGRITOURISM.
IF THAT SIMPLIFIES IT A LITTLE BIT.
AND, AND, AND I, I JUST, JUST TO BE TRANSPARENT, MY QUESTION COMES ALONG THE LINES OF WHAT'S TAKING PLACE IN RICHMOND.
I NOTICED IN RICHMOND THAT THEY'RE HAVING A LOT OF PROBLEMS RIGHT NOW WITH THIS, UH, AIR AIRBNB, UH, HAVING RIGHT RESTRICTIONS NOT ALLOWING, UH, WEEKEND, UH, STAYS BY PEOPLE, COLLEGE KIDS AND NOT ALLOWING 'EM TO STAY BECAUSE, UH, THEM NO NAME FRATERNITIES AND SORORITIES, THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO PARTY WITH DIGNITY.
YOU GET MAD DRIFT THAT'S TOUCHING BASED ON SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT CAN COME ALONG WITH SHORT TERM RENTALS, WHICH IS WHAT AN ORDINANCE THAT WE'RE TRYING TO DRAFT IS GONNA ATTEMPT TO ADDRESS.
SO THAT'S ACTUALLY KIND OF LEADING INTO SOME OF THE RESEARCH THAT WE'RE DOING.
RICHMOND CITY, WE WOULD HAVE TO SPECIFICALLY RESEARCH THEM.
[01:05:01]
KNOW, I BELIEVE RIGHT NOW THEY'RE NOT REGULATED IN P PETERSBURG CITY.AND SOME OF THE COMMENTS THAT MIKE MADE ACTUALLY REMINDED ME, AND PLEASE FORGIVE ME, MY THOUGHTS ARE RACING.
UM, BUT THE ISSUE OF SHORT TERM RENTALS IS NOT UNIQUE TO DENWITTY.
SO I JUST WANTED TO MAKE THAT CLEAR TO YOU ALL.
THERE ARE COUNTIES AND CITIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY THAT ARE GRAPPLING WITH THIS ISSUE.
AND IF YOU WERE TO TALK TO A LOT OF OUR NEIGHBORS AND COUNTIES AND CITIES IN VIRGINIA AND ASK THEM WHAT THEY WERE DOING.
YOU'RE GONNA GET TONS OF DIFFERENT RESPONSES.
UM, 'CAUSE I'VE, I'VE GONE AND I HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH OTHER PLANNERS AND SOME COUNTIES HAVE TAKEN A HANDS-OFF APPROACH AND JUST CONSIDER THEM TO BE, UM, NOT PERMITTED.
OTHER COUNTIES CONSIDER THEM TO BE ALLOWED AND HAVE ADOPTED ORDINANCES.
UM, SOME ORDINANCES ARE SOPHISTICATED, SOME ARE PRETTY SIMPLE.
SO YOU JUST FIND A MIX OF DIFFERENT THINGS THAT COUNTIES AND CITIES ARE DOING TO TRY TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE.
SO I WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT NWI IS NOT THE ONLY CLY TRYING TO DEAL WITH THIS.
UM, THE CURRENT POLICY THAT WE HAVE WAS A RESULT OF DISCUSSION SOME TIME AGO.
AND SO NOW WE'RE BEING ASKED TO EVALUATE THAT AND DO WE WANT TO EXPAND HOW WE REGULATE SHORT TERM RENTALS OUTSIDE OF THE AGRITOURISM? SO NOISE, UH, AS YOU'RE SAYING, UM, COULD BE SOME OF THE ISSUES IN A SITUATION WHERE A, A RENTAL IS BEING USED FOR A PARTY.
UM, YOU HAVE TO THINK ABOUT ISSUES IN THE MORE DENSE, UM, DEVELOPED AREAS SUCH AS PARKING, UH, TRASH HOURS, UM, AND MAKING SURE THAT THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY IS GONNA BE RESPONSIBLE OVERSIGHT OF THAT.
MR. ROBINSON, LET ME BREAK IN AGAIN TOO.
THE, THE REASON DENWITTY IN THAT CHART HAS GOT A LOT OF XS IN, IN AGRITOURISM IS, UM, THE VI THE COUNTY IS RESTRICTED ON HOW WE REGULATE AGRITOURISM.
SO WE, IN OTHER, WHICH IS VERY RESTRICTED, THE VIRGINIA CODE RESTRICTS WHAT WE CAN DO AND NOT DO.
SO YOU UNDERSTAND ME? SO IF YOU'VE GOT A AGRITOURISM FARM STAY, UM, WE CAN'T, WE CAN, WE CAN REGULATE THEM, BUT WE CAN'T UNNECESSARILY PROHIBIT THEM IN A AG SETTING FROM WHAT THEY WANNA DO.
FROM DOING WHAT THEY WANT TO DO.
UM, BUT YOU CAN PUT SOME RULES AND REGULATIONS IN, AND MR. ROBINSON MAY BE LEADING TO THIS, BUT A BIG DEAL IS IF YOU DO ALLOW THEM BEYOND AGRITOURISM, YOU CAN, WHAT ZONES AM I, AND A LOT OF DISCUSSION WE HAD LAST FALL THAT WAS POSITIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT HOW THIS TYPE OF USE WILL COMPLEMENT, UM, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
AND WE CERTAINLY AGREE WITH THAT, BUT, UH, ONE OF THE ISSUES NATIONWIDE WITH SHORT TERM RENTALS IS THAT THEY DO AFFECT YOUR HOUSING STOCK IN THE COUNTY.
UH, SO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU PICTURE, FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU HAVE A SUBDIVISION THAT HAS 10 HOMES AND EIGHT OF THOSE HOMES ARE BEING RENTED FOR AIRBNBS, THAT ESSENTIALLY HAS SOMEWHAT CHANGED THE CHARACTER OF THAT NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND WHEN PEOPLE BUY INTO CERTAIN AREAS, THEY ARE EXPECTING A CERTAIN PROTECTION OF THEIR INVESTMENT.
SO THOSE ARE THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT IN CRAFTING AN ORDINANCE, UH, THE POSITIVES AS WELL AS THE NEGATIVES THAT COME WITH THIS TYPE OF USE.
UM, I OF COURSE WORK UP HERE AND GOT A FARM.
UM, WE HAVE AGRITOURISM ACTIVITIES, UM, ON OUR FARM.
AND JUST WANTED TO TELL Y'ALL TOO, AND THIS IS NOT A PRO OR CON, I, I DIDN'T REALIZE THIS, BUT WE HAVE A OLDER HOME THAT I RESTORED ON THE PROPERTY AND, UH, USED TO LONG TERM RENT IT OUT.
AND QUITE FRANKLY, I HAD SOME BAD TENANTS SOME TIME OR TWO AND GOT TIRED OF THAT AND SAID, WELL, I'LL JUST USE IT FOR FRIENDS AND FAMILY AND THEN FOUND AIRBNB.
IT SERIOUSLY, IT HAS THE GREAT NEWS FOR US.
IT HAS TURNED INTO THE, UM, HIGHEST BY MULTIPLES CASH FLOW ON THE FARM PEOPLE WANT.
BUT, BUT I'M IN A SITUATION WHERE THERE'S, YOU UNDERSTAND ME, THERE'S NO NEIGHBORS, THERE'S NO THIS AND THAT.
AND QUITE FRANKLY, FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, I, I'M, I'M NOT GONNA LET SOMEBODY COME IN THERE THAT'S DISRESPECTFUL, PERIOD.
BUT AGAIN, I'M IN A SETTING THAT TRULY IS AGRITOURISM AND
[01:10:01]
THERE'S NOBODY AROUND.BUT, UH, BUT THE REASON I JUST BRING THAT UP IS JUST LET Y'ALL KNOW THAT IF IT'S DONE RIGHT, UM, IT'S TREMENDOUSLY HELPED US, UM, WITH FARMING INCOME.
AND I DIDN'T QUITE REALIZE THAT.
I THOUGHT IT WAS JUST GONNA BE JUST SOME MONEY COMING IN FROM TIME TO TIME.
SO, AND IT IS STILL SPORADIC, BUT, UH, THERE'S, THERE'S, THERE'S PEOPLE THAT WANNA COME OUTTA THE CITIES AND THEY DON'T HAVE TO TRAVEL TOO FAR.
YOU KNOW, I'M IN SURY COUNTY AND A LOT OF OUR, THERE ARE A LOT OF OUT OF STATE TRAVELERS, BUT A LOT OF 'EM ARE JUST, THEY LIVE IN RICHMOND, JUST WANNA GET TO THE COUNTRY.
SO ANYWAY, SO THERE'S A, THERE'S A MARKET FOR IT.
SO MR. JEW MADE A COMMENT, UH, WITH A LOT OF THE, RIGHT NOW THE AIRBNBS THAT WE DO HAVE THAT ARE IN THE RURAL AREAS, IN THE AG AREAS, ARE IN LESS POPULATED AREAS WHERE THEY ARE NOT AS MUCH OF AN IMPACT.
UH, SO THAT IS ONE REASON WHY, IF WE'RE THINKING ABOUT EXPANDING THEM, UH, WE WOULD WANT FEEDBACK MAYBE WHAT OTHER AREAS OF THE COUNTY WOULD BE APPROPRIATE, WHAT OTHER ZONES.
SO TO FOLLOW UP ON WHAT BRAD SAID IS, AS WE'VE TYPICALLY DONE, YOU KNOW, WE KNOW WE'RE KIND OF HITTING YOU ALL COLD THIS EVENING ON, ON THIS TOPIC AS, AS WELL AS THE PREVIOUS ONE.
SO IF, IF YOU NEED TIME TO THINK ABOUT ZONING DISTRICTS WHERE YOU THINK IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE OR WHERE YOU DON'T THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE, UM, WE JUST WANT TO GET FEEDBACK FROM YOU ALL, INPUT FROM YOU ALL ON THAT.
UM, SO WE CAN EITHER MOVE FORWARD WITH IT OR, UM, YOU KNOW, NOT MOVE FORWARD WITH, WITH IT.
SO, UM, JUST WANT YOU ALL TO SPEND SOME TIME, YOU KNOW, THINKING ABOUT WHERE YOU THINK IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO, TO HAVE THIS TYPE OF USE IF YOU THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE.
MR. ROBINSON, WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO READ THROUGH WHAT I'VE SEEN IN AL MALLS? NOT, NOT IN DEPTH, JUST BE SOME OF THE, THAT THAT WOULD BE FINE.
SOME OF THE RESTRICTIONS BE, AND THIS IS MM-HMM
AND, AND THIS IS MAINLY TAKEN FROM AL MALL.
I DON'T HAVE THAT EVIDENCE SITTING IN FRONT OF ME, BUT THEY HAVE A ANNUAL REGISTRATION AND IT'S A $30 FEE, UH, JUST TO COVER THE COST TO MAINTAIN THE REGISTRY.
UM, THEY HAVE A NON-GI REGISTRATION PENALTY, AND AGAIN, THIS IS THEM JUST TRYING TO GET THEIR HANDS AROUND.
RIGHT NOW, MS. STEVENS RECEIVES A CHECK AND DOESN'T KNOW WHERE IT'S COMING FROM REALLY, ANYWAY.
THEY DON'T PUT THE ADDRESSES OF THE LOCATIONS THAT, THAT IS ASSOCIATED WITH.
I, AND AGAIN, SHE WOULD HAVE TO ANSWER THAT, BUT THAT'S, THAT'S A COMMISSIONER OF REVENUE.
BUT FOR A LOT, THEY HAD A, THEY HAD A HARD TIME.
THIS IS A STEP PROCESS FOR A LONG TIME.
THEY WEREN'T SENDING ANYTHING IN.
AND THEN THE FIRST STEP WAS JUST TO GET 'EM TO RECOGNIZE.
THEY WERE LIKE, NO, THE HOMEOWNER SHOULD DO THAT.
AND SO THE COMMISSIONER'S, REVENUES ASSOCIATIONS DID FINALLY, I THINK THROUGH THE STEPS MM-HMM
GET THE HOSTING COMPANIES TO GO, OKAY, WE'LL DO IT.
SO THEY'RE STILL TRYING TO PUSH, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME FOR MORE, BUT AT THIS POINT IN TIME, THEY'RE GETTING MONEY, YOU KNOW, AND EVERYTHING ELSE.
UM, SHORT TERM REGULATIONS, FOR INSTANCE, OTHER LOCALITIES, UM, THEY TALK ABOUT, UH, ALL STREET PARKING.
AND AGAIN, THIS IS COMING IN MORE, NOT RURAL AREAS, BUT MORE URBAN SETTINGS THAT THEY HAVE TO HAVE ONE PARKING SPACE PER BEDROOM.
UM, THEY MUST PROVIDE A NAME AND TELEPHONE NUMBER OF A RESPONSIBLE PERSON IN CASE THERE IS AN ISSUE THAT THE COUNTY CAN GET, YOU KNOW, IN TOUCH WITH SOMEBODY.
UM, THEY, UH, THEY SOMETIMES LIMIT HOW MANY NIGHTLY RENTALS PER CONSECUTIVE SEVEN DAY PERIOD.
AND I THINK THAT PROBABLY IS DRIVING AT, RATHER THAN HAVING A FLOW OF PEOPLE LIKE SEVEN RENTALS IN ONE WEEK, IF YOU UNDERSTAND ME, YOU CAN'T HAVE A TWO OR THREE OR SOMETHING, TWO OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
UM, SOMEBODY WANT SOMEBODY MOVE IN AND REFUSE TO MOVE OUT.
WELL, IT, IT'S NOT SO MUCH OF THAT.
I THINK THAT'S MORE OF THE, OH, TURNOVER IN A URBAN SETTING OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
UM, INSURANCE, UH, THEY TALK ABOUT WHEN OUTDOOR AMPLIFIED SOUND, UM, YOU CAN'T DO IT.
UM, THEY'VE GOT, UH, SOME OF THEM HAVE THE MAXIMUM NUMBER OF PEOPLE ON THE PROPERTY AFTER OVERNIGHT AND LIMITED, UH, TO TWO OR THREE PEOPLE PER BEDROOM.
SO I, I JUST WANT TO GET, UM, AND ACCESSORY STRUCTURES CAN'T BE, UH, YOU KNOW, USED FOR
[01:15:01]
IT.SO I'M JUST TRYING TO GIVE YOU A FLAVOR OF WHAT I'VE SEEN AND OTHER ORDINANCES TO KIND OF GET YOU.
AND THEN THEY, THEN THEY SPECIFY WHAT ZONING DISTRICTS, YOU KNOW, THAT CAN BE, AND WHICH THIS CAN BE DONE.
SO ARE, ARE YOU ASKING US THEN TO MODIFY, ARE YOU ASKING US THEN TO, UH, MODIFY OR LOOK AT EXPANDING THE ZONING DISTRICTS? I, I THINK THAT'S US BRINGING TO YOU THIS, TO YOU TONIGHT, IS TO TRY TO GAUGE IF THE COUNTY REALLY WANTS TO TRY TO MOVE FORWARD WITH CHANGING THE POLICY, OR ARE WE SATISFIED WITH THE CURRENT POLICY JUST TO TRY TO GET A CLEAR SENSE OF THAT.
AND IF, IF THE DIRECTION IS TO CHANGE THE POLICY, WE'RE CERTAINLY FINE WITH THAT.
I THOUGHT I HAVE A COPY OF IT.
IT'S ESSENTIALLY THE CURRENT POLICY.
YEAH, THE CURRENT POLICY IS AGRITOURISM.
SO WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A TOURIST HOME AND A BOARDING HOUSE AGAIN? UH, GOOD QUESTION.
WELL, AND MY FOLLOW UP TO THAT WAS IF YOU HAVE THOSE TWO, WHAT'S, WHAT'S WRONG WITH HAVING A BED AND BREAKFAST? WELL, THOSE, THOSE ARE ONLY ALLOWED IN CERTAIN DISTRICTS.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THOSE USES NO, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT I'M, I'M JUST POSTULATING IF YOU'RE GONNA HAVE THOSE TWO, AND I COULDN'T REALLY DISCERN THE DIFFERENCE IN THE TWO, BUT IF, ASSUMING THEY'RE RELATIVELY THE SAME, WHY WOULD, WHY WOULDN'T A BED AND BREAKFAST BE JUST AS GOOD EITHER? SAD.
THE ONE OF THE THINGS THAT DISTINGUISHES, UH, SHORT TERM RENTAL ACTIVITY OR AIRBNBS FROM BED AND BREAKFAST IS TYPICALLY WITH AIRBNBS, THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY IS NOT PRESENT, UM, WITH A BED AND BREAKFAST, THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY WOULD BE PRESENT AND PROVIDE SOME TYPE OF HOSPITALITY.
UM, WE HAVE TRIED TO GIVE SOME OF THE CUSTOMERS AND CITIZENS THAT WE DEAL WITH OTHER OPTIONS OF IF THEY WANTED TO CONSIDER THOSE TYPE OF USES.
BUT IT SEEMS THE MAJORITY OF THE TIME THEY WANT TO DO AN AIRBNB WHERE THEY'RE ABSENT.
BUT YOU KNOW, YOU HAD, IF YOU HAD A, IF YOU WERE LIVING IN A HOUSE, YOU HAD KIDS AND YOU HAD SAY, TOTAL OF FOUR BEDROOMS AND YOUR KIDS GROW UP AND NOW YOU'VE GOT EXTRA BEDROOMS, VOILA.
YOU KNOW, YOU'VE GOT AN OPPORTUNITY.
SO FOR BAB, WELL, FOR, YEAH, FOR THE BED AND BREAKFAST.
I MEAN THAT'S WHY, THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING WHY THERE WASN'T AN EX, YOU KNOW, I'M JUST THROWING IT OUT AGAIN.
MAYBE WE OUGHT TO THINK ABOUT HAVING AN EX THERE TO PROVIDE THAT OPPORTUNITY.
UM, AND DID YOU SEE WHAT THE DIFFERENCE IN THE TWO WERE? I CAN READ THE DEFINITIONS IF YOU'D LIKE.
SO WE DEFINE A BOARDING HOUSE AS A BUILDING WHERE FOR COMPENSATION, LODGING, AND MEALS ARE PROVIDED FOR AT LEAST FIVE AND UP TO 14 PERSONS.
SO LODGING AND MEALS ARE PROVIDED FOR BETWEEN FIVE AND 14 PERSONS.
WE DEFINE A TOURIST HOME AS BEING A DWELLING WHERE ONLY LODGING IS PROVIDED FOR COMPENSATION FOR UP TO 14 PERSONS AND OPEN TO TRANSIENTS SOUNDS PRETTY SIMILAR TO ME, OTHER THAN THE MEALS YOU GOING TO GET YOUR MEAT.
NOTHING, YOU KNOW, YOU GOTTA GET, YOU GOTTA COOK YOUR OWN FOOD.
I, I THINK POSSIBLY, AND I DON'T KNOW, I, I WOULD THINK THOSE TERMS HAVE BEEN IN THE, DIDN'T WE EAT ZONING CODE FOR A VERY, VERY LONG TIME? YES.
MAYBE EVEN FROM THE VERY BEGINNING.
SOME OF THESE USES MAY BE OUTDATED.
DO WE EVEN HAVE A BOARDING HOUSE IN COUNTY
BUT WE GOT TRACTOR TRAILERS DELIVERING FOOD FOR PIGEONS THOUGH.
UM, SO ARE WE HAVING A BIG ISSUE WITH THESE TYPE EVENTS?
[01:20:02]
THE DEPARTMENT HAS RECEIVED INQUIRIES FROM CERTAIN PERSONS, UM, WHO ARE INTERESTED IN CONDUCTING THIS USE.AND THE INQUIRIES ARE NOT ALWAYS AN ASSOCIATION WITH AGRITOURISM.
YEAH, WE, WE HAVE INQUIRIES FROM PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN OUR SINGLE FAMILY ZONING DISTRICTS.
AND TO ADD TO WHERE WE, WHERE THE COUNTY WANTS TO THINK ABOUT, UH, THIS USE, IF WE ARE INTERESTED IN CHANGING THE POLICY, UH, A GOOD NUMBER OF INQUIRERS COME FROM THE LAKE CHESTERTON SIDE OF THE COUNTY ALONG THE LAKE.
IS THAT ZONED R TWO? A LOT OF R ONE.
BUT AS YOU MOVE FURTHER WEST, IT'S A LOT OF RR ONE ZONING AND MAYBE EVEN RR.
RR IS FIVE ACRE MINIMUM LOT SIZES.
RR ONE IS THE TWO ACRE MINIMUM LOT SIZES.
AND THEN WITH R ONE ZONING, IF YOU DON'T HAVE, WELL, IF YOU'RE ON A WELL AND SEPTIC, IT'S AN ACRE AND A HALF.
SO JUST TO GIVE YOU KIND OF AN IDEA OF THE DENSITY RELATED TO THOSE ZONING DISTRICTS, WATERFORD LANDING IN THEIR, UM, COVENANTS, UM, THEY DO LIST THAT THEY BASICALLY DO NOT ALLOW AIRBNB.
OF COURSE, WHEN THOSE WERE ADOPTED, YOU KNOW, MANY YEARS AGO, OVER 30 YEARS AGO NOW, UM, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK AIRBNB WAS AROUND, BUT IT DOES PROHIBIT SHORT TERM RENTALS IN THAT, IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD EXCLUSIVELY.
WHICH, WHICH BRINGS UP A POINT.
UM, THE COUNTY CAN'T, WE, WE DON'T OVERRIDE, UM, HOA COVENANTS.
I'M, I'M A LITTLE SURPRISED THAT LONG AGO, MOST, MOST LEGAL QUESTIONS TO ME PERSONALLY, UH, ABOUT THIS ISSUE IS IN OLDER SUBDIVISIONS THAT EITHER DON'T HAVE HOAS AND I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT DENWITTY, I'M JUST OVERALL OR HAVE HOAS WITH NO RESTRICTIONS AND THEY WANT TO RESTRICT IT, WHICH AS Y'ALL KNOW, IS DIFFICULT AFTER YOU GOT A BUNCH OF RIGHT HOMEOWNERS TO DO IT.
SO, SO WHAT DOES THE LANGUAGE IN WATERFORD LANDING STATE TO RESTRICT IT? DON'T, DO YOU REMEMBER? I DON'T, I DON'T HAVE THAT IN FRONT OF ME.
BUT IT DOES, IT DOES LIMIT SHORT TERM.
IT DOES SHORT TERM STAYS AND RENTALS OF THE, OF PROPERTY.
UH, I UNDERSTAND THE NEED FOR THIS.
UH, THE BIGGEST THING IS TO BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY WHAT PROPERTIES HAVE THIS AND WHAT PROPERTIES DON'T HAVE THIS.
UH, BECAUSE NOW WE HAVE NO WAY OF KNOWING IF YOU HAVE IT OR IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT, IF YOU'RE DOING IT ILLEGALLY.
UH, AND WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TELLING YOU THAT YOU NEED TO REPORT IT TO US OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
UH, RIGHT NOW, THE WAY WE MONITOR THE ACTIVITY IN THE COUNTY IS BETWEEN THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT AND THE COMMISSIONER REVENUES OFFICE.
THE PERIODICALLY CHECK THE DIFFERENT RENTAL WEBSITES, UM, FOR WHO HAS, UM, INITIATED A NEW RENTAL.
UH, AND SO TYPICALLY PERSONS WHO, WHO HAVE DONE THAT WITHOUT UH, OBTAINING A BUSINESS LICENSE WILL RECEIVE A LETTER FROM THE COMMISSIONER OF THE REVENUES OFFICE.
AND AFTER THAT POINT, SOME PEOPLE WILL ELECT TO JUST REMOVE THE POSTING.
OTHERS COME INTO ACQUIRE, UM, HOW THEY CAN OBTAIN ANY DOCUMENTS OR PERMITS TO MOVE FORWARD WITH IT.
HOW MUCH IS A FINE FOR THAT? THERE'S NOT A FINE ON OUR END.
I'D HAVE TO, UH, INQUIRE WITH THAT.
WITH THE COMMISSIONER REVENUE'S OFFICE.
THERE WOULD BE A, IF YOU DON'T GET A BUSINESS PERMIT SHEET, YEAH, THE COMMISSIONER REVENUE CAN CAN, THERE'S A PENALTY ASSOCIATE WITH THAT IF YOU DON'T COMPLY.
I JUST, I, MY BIGGEST THING IS, IS I DON'T UN, I KNOW KIND OF THE DIRECTION THAT THE COUNTY WANTS TO GO IN, BUT I DON'T KNOW THE DIRECTION, LIKE THE AIRBNB.
DO WE WANT TO SPECIFY THAT OR BRBO OR WHOEVER, IF YOU'RE JUST A SHORT TERM STATE, DO WE WANT TO ALLOW IT IN RR OR R ONE THAT I UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, ARE WE GONNA ALLOW IT THERE?
[01:25:01]
ARE WE GOING TO STRICTLY KEEP IT OUT IN THE COUNTRY OR MORE IN THE COUNTRY THAN SOMEWHERE ELSE? BUT I GUESS THAT'S WHERE I WOULD WANT TO KNOW IS THE COUNTY, WOULD THEY LIKE TO OPEN IT UP A LITTLE MORE? DO THEY SEE THAT AS A POSITIVE? DO THEY NOT SEE IT AS A POSITIVE? UH, I DEFINITELY UNDERSTAND THE REGULATIONS OF WANTING TO, TO HAVE A REGISTRATION.I MEAN THAT'S JUST, JUST GOOD INFORMATION TO HAVE AND IF SOMETHING WAS GOING WRONG, UH, TO HAVE A RESPONSIBLE PARTY THAT YOU CAN GET UP WITH THAT OWNS THAT.
I MEAN, I CAN ONLY IMAGINE SOMEBODY COMES OUT AND MASS MURDERS FOUR OR FIVE PEOPLE OUT AT A FARM STAY AND WE DON'T KNOW WHO TO GET IN TOUCH WITH TO GET OUT THERE TO DO ANYTHING.
OR YOU KNOW, I CAN JUST SEE A HOST OF DIFFERENT PROBLEMS THAT CAN COME UP IF YOU DON'T HAVE THAT.
SO THAT I UNDERSTAND COMPLETELY.
IT'S JUST WHETHER THEY WANT THIS COUNTY WANTS TO DECIDE TO PUT IT IN SOMETHING OTHER THAN IN AGRICULTURE AND UNDER FARM STATE IS WHAT I WOULD ASK.
IF THEY DON'T, THEN LET'S BE RESTRICTED.
BUT IF YOU WANT TO ALLOW THIS IN THE NORTH END FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO RENT THEIR HOME, IF THERE'S A BIG VIRGINIA STATE FOOTBALL GAME AND THERE'S JUST NOT A LOT OF GOOD PLACES, OR PEOPLE WANT TO STAY AT A HOUSE WITH A BUNCH OF FRIENDS INSTEAD OF A HOTEL, THEN I UNDERSTAND THAT.
UH, OR FOR THE RACETRACK ISSUES WITH, YOU KNOW, HAVING EXTRA PLACES THEY CAN STAY AND ALL THAT, IF YOU THINK THAT'S GONNA HELP YOU, I UNDERSTAND, BUT I'M TRYING TO GET A READ ON WHAT IT IS, THE COUNTY OR THE BOARD, OR WHETHER IT'S THE COMMISSIONER OF THE REVENUE OR WHO IT IS THAT WANTS SOME KIND OF PATH FOR THIS.
AND THEN I THINK WE COULD BE MORE, WOULD BE MORE THAN WELCOME TO TRY TO HELP SHAPE THAT AND MOVE IT IN THE RIGHT PATH.
ARE YOU GETTING A LOT OF, UH, INQUIRIES FROM THE, UH, CITIZENS OF THE COUNTY? CITIZENS WHO WANT TO OPERATE A SHORT TERM RENTAL? YES.
'CAUSE YOU WANT, YOU DIDN'T ANSWER IT.
THEY'RE NOT AT A TWO, THEY'RE IN.
THEY'RE EITHER NOT IN A TWO OR IF THEY ARE IN A TWO, THEY ARE NOT A AGRICULTURAL OPERATION.
NOW, MIKE BREWERY'S GOT ME THINKING I NEED A BUNCH OF LITTLE CABINS OUT NOW.
THE POND AT THE HOUSE, STARVING FISH, FISH IN THE FISH POND.
SO YOU ASK THE FISH, HOW BIG OF A GARDEN WOULD I HAVE TO PLANT AN A TWO
I BELIEVE YOU MAKE $1,800 IN REVENUE OFF OF YOUR PRODUCTS.
IF, IF SOMEBODY COMES IN HERE AND WANTS TO DO A FARM STAY AND THEY SAID THAT THE PEOPLE COME THERE AND PICK MINT FOR TEA THAT THEY CAN TAKE BACK TO RICHMOND, YOU'RE THERE.
IT, IT MAKES IT VERY TOUGH FOR BRAD TO TRY TO ADMINISTER
BUT YOU ASKED A GOOD QUESTION.
WE REALLY, OUTSIDE OF BEING ASKED TO WORK ON THIS AS STAFF, WE REALLY DON'T HAVE WHAT THE COMMUNITY SENTIMENT IS ON THIS ISSUE.
AND I HAVEN'T BEEN PRODU, I MEAN, I HAVEN'T BEEN APPROACHED BY ANYBODY ASKING ABOUT AIRBNBS OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT DO WE HAVE 'EM? AND SOME PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THE, UH, FARM STATE STUFF, BUT THAT'S ABOUT IT.
OR THE HIP CAMP HAS BEEN MORE OF WHAT I'M THINKING OF.
SO THERE'S NO COMPLAINT DRIVEN STUFF GOING ON HERE, RIGHT? NO, NOT, NO.
IT'S MAINLY BEEN, I KNOW THREE DIFFERENT INDIVIDUALS HAVE CONTACTED BOARD MEMBERS AND ASKED THEM TO, TO LOOK AT THIS AND WELL, WHAT'D THEY COME UP WITH? THE BOARD MEMBERS? MM-HMM
THEY JUST ASKED US TO WORK WITH THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO
YOU KNEW THAT WAS GONNA BE THE ANSWER, DIDN'T YOU?
I MEAN, BRAD AND I HAVE, WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT FOR AN HOUR.
AND WE HAVEN'T, IT, IT IS GOING TO, IT STILL STILL GOT NOWHERE.
I MEAN, SO I I THINK HUDDY AND BRAD BROUGHT UP VERY GOOD POINTS AND THAT, THAT'S BEEN THE FRUSTRATION MAINLY FOR BRAD, IS THE ZONING
[01:30:01]
ADMINISTRATOR IS WHAT DOES, AS MR. CHIPMAN SAID, THE THE COUNTY, THE CITIZENS.WOULD THEY BE IN FAVOR OF THIS OR DO THEY THINK OF IT AS BE A POSITIVE THING? DO, IS IT SOMETHING THE COUNTY NEEDS TO DO? WE, YOU KNOW, AS BRAD INDICATED, WE DON'T HAVE A, A GOOD GRASP OF, UM, I CAN SEE THE ISSUES.
LIKE LET'S SAY WE OPEN IT UP TO A RESIDENTIAL AREA, PARTIES GET THROWN, THINGS LIKE THAT IN THAT AIRBNB ON A REGULAR BASIS.
IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S REALLY NOT THE PERSON'S HOME AND THEY'RE RENTING IT ON THE WEEKEND WHEN, YOU KNOW, A BIG RACE IS IN TOWN.
THEY'RE JUST, THERE'S JUST A PLACE TO GO RENT AND PARTY.
AND THEN NEIGHBORS DON'T LIKE THAT.
'CAUSE ALL THE PARTYING THAT GOES ON WHERE I UNDERSTAND IN THE A TWO, YOU'RE FAR ENOUGH AWAY THAT GENERALLY YOU'RE NOT GONNA EXPERIENCE ANY OF THAT ISSUE.
BUT I KNOW THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT WOULD LIKE TO DO IT.
AND THEN TOO, IF YOU GET IN A TOO DENSE OF AN AREA, YOU GOT PARKING PROBLEMS. SURE, SURE.
IT DEPENDS ON LIKE HOW MANY PEOPLE, LIKE, IF IT IS A PARTY, IT COULD BE 50 PLUS PEOPLE COMING THERE, 50.
YOU HAVE 40 DIFFERENT CARS PARKED IN, IN THAT AREA.
MOST OF THE COUNTIES, AND THERE'S VERY FEW, BUT MOST OF THE COUNTIES THAT HAVE PUT THIS IN, AS I SAID, THEY DO HAVE REGULATIONS.
AND IF YOU VIOLATED, IF THEY HAVE, UH, VIOLATED MORE THAN X AMOUNT OF TIMES, USUALLY IT'S ABOUT THREE.
YOU, YOU GET YOUR PERMIT GETS YANKED.
SO, AND THEY DO LIMIT THE NIGHT.
SHOULD START AT THAT END OF THIS.
HUH? SPECTRUM AND WORK BACKWARDS.
UM, IN ANOTHER MEETING WE HAD IT WOULD, THE QUESTION CAME UP ABOUT AIRBNB AND I THINK THE QUESTION WAS, IT IT, DO WE HAVE ENOUGH BUSINESS? IS THERE ENOUGH BUSINESS IN DEN WITH COUNTY FOR AN AIRBNB? AND I BOUGHT UP ONE INSTANCE AND ONCE I BOUGHT IT UP, I DIDN'T KNOW IF I HAD GOTTEN SOMEONE IN TROUBLE OR NOT.
BUT I, I'LL BRING IT UP AGAIN 'CAUSE I WON'T MAKE ANY, I WON'T CALL ANY NAMES, BUT IT SEEMS TO BE, UH, A GOOD PROPOSITION WITH THE AIRBNB.
EVEN IN THE COUNTY WHERE WE LIVE.
I LIVE, AS I STATED BEFORE, OFF OF, UH, CARSON ROAD 7 0 3.
IT REACHES FROM INTERSTATE 85 TO INTERSTATE NINE, FIVE.
I LIVE IN THE MIDDLE AND I LIVE IN THE COUNTRY.
AND THERE'S NOTHING HAPPENING IN THE COUNTRY.
BUT THIS LADY IS, UH, SHE OWNS THIS FARM NOW THAT HER FATHER LEFT THE FAMILY FARM.
AND, AND ONCE HER MOTHER AND FATHER PASSED AWAY, THE HOUSE IS VACANT AND SHE'S BEEN USING THIS HOUSE FOR A TERM I WOULD CALL NAB AND B.
AND SHE IS VERY LUCRATIVE IN THAT BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE PEOPLE ARE COMING FROM.
I DON'T KNOW WHY THEY'RE COMING OUT OF THE COUNTRY, BUT IT'S WORKING FOR HER.
UM, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT SHE'S CALLING IT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND OF PERMIT SHE HAS OR WHAT, BUT I BELIEVE THE ONE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS LEGAL.
SO LET ME, LET ME PREFACE SOMETHING TOO IS THAT WHEN I SAID WE, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU, WELL, AT LEAST OVER IN SURREY COUNTY, IF YOU CAN GET ENOUGH RENT OFF YOUR FARM TO PAY THE TAXES AND A LITTLE BIT OF INSURANCE YOU'RE CARRYING ON THE FARM, THAT'S ABOUT IT.
WHAT, WHAT THIS HAS DONE FOR US, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT, IT IS NOT MAKING CASH THAT I CAN GO AHEAD AND BUY A FANCY NEW CAR.
WHAT IT'S DOING, AND THIS GOES TO MY HEART A LITTLE BIT, IT'S ALLOWING ME TO KEEP UP THE OLD HOUSE ON OUR FARM.
'CAUSE THEY, UH, GET SOMEBODY TO PAINT ONE THESE DAYS AND YOU MIGHT GET A INVOICE BACK FOR $10,000.
SO IT'S, IT'S ALLOWING ME TO UPKEEP SOME OF THE FARM BUILDINGS.
SO, UM, I'M GONNA MOVE THIS ALONG A LITTLE BIT.
WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT EITHER STAFF NEEDS TO TALK THIS AT A FORWARD WORKSHOP OR DO SOMETHING TO REACH OUT TO THE PUBLIC TO GET MORE INFORMATION.
AND I'LL LET Y'ALL RUN WITH THAT.
I DON'T KNOW THAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR DEFINITE, JUST SOME TYPE OF DIRECTION.
AND THEY CERTAINLY COULD GO TO THE BOARD AND, AND OR TRY TO GET OUT MORE INFORMATION FROM THE PUBLIC.
WELL, I DEFINITELY FEEL LIKE WE NEED THE REGISTRATION ASPECT OF
[01:35:01]
IT.AND IF YOU ARE ONE, EVEN IF YOU'RE OUT IN THE A TWO, THERE'D BE SOME RESTRICTION TO HOW MANY PEOPLE CAN BE THERE, HOW MANY CARS, WHATEVER IT IS YOU MADE REFERENCE TO, AMPLIFIED NOISE, SOME THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT WOULD DEFINITELY BE POSITIVES BECAUSE THEN YOU HAVE SOME RECOURSE THAT IF THAT DID GET OUTTA CONTROL, YOU CAN GO SNATCH THAT AWAY.
IS THERE A TIMEFRAME TOO THAT ALL NOISE HAS TO BE SHUT DOWN BY A CERTAIN TIME? IF IT IS IN A, OR I WOULD SAY THEY PROBABLY JUST REFERENCED THE NOISE ORDINANCE MM-HMM
THAT DEWIN COUNTY ALREADY HAS.
AND SAY IF IT GOES AGAINST THAT, THEN YOU'RE IN VIOLATION.
UM, ALBA MALL'S ORDINANCE ACTUALLY LISTS TIME THAT CAN BE NO OUTSIDE AMPLIFIED NOISE FROM 10:00 PM TO 10:00 AM AGAIN, THAT'S JUST THE ALCOHOL.
I MEAN, I THINK ONCE WE GET INTO IT, THERE MIGHT BE SOME THINGS WE'D ADD, BUT IT'S JUST STARTING THAT PROCESS.
AND THEN MAKING THE DECISION IF YOU WANTED IT IN OTHER AREAS.
LIKE, I DON'T KNOW THAT, I HATE TO SAY IT, BUT I DON'T THINK UP IN ROUND BRICKWOOD AND ALL THAT IN THAT AREA THAT I DON'T KNOW HOW CONDUCIVE IT WOULD BE TO HAVE THESE THERE.
BUT IT COULD BE, I MEAN, I, THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT GO TO 'EM THAT YOU WOULDN'T KNOW THEY WERE ANYBODY ELSE THAT DIDN'T LIVE THERE.
THEY GO THERE, THEY EAT THERE, THEY WATCH TV, AND THEY'RE STAYING ON THEIR TRIP AND THEY GO TO A FOOTBALL GAME AT VIRGINIA STATE, OR THEY GO TO THE RACETRACK AND WATCH THE RACES AND THEN THEY GO HOME.
AND THE GOOD PEOPLE, THEN YOU GOT SITUATIONS LIKE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, THEY HAVE IN RICHMOND, AND PEOPLE GO, WELL, INSTEAD OF TRASHING MY HOUSE, WE CAN TRASH THAT HOUSE AND IT WOULD BE A LOT NICER AND GO AND RENT SOMEWHERE LIKE THIS AND JUST TRASH IT.
AND IN THAT OPINION, I WOULD SAY IF YOU WANTED AN AIRBNB, THAT'S WHEN YOU NEED TO HAVE AN IRONCLAD CONTRACT THAT YOU CAN GO BACK ON SOMEBODY AND YOU CAN REALLY BUST A, A NEW ONE WHEN IT COMES TO DOING THAT.
LET ME AGAIN, THAT I TELL YOU ALL THIS TOO, IS THAT, UM, THESE HOSTING SITES, YOU, WHEN YOU STAY THERE, YOU'RE REQUIRED TO GIVE A, UM, THAT'S TRUE.
YOU HAVE TO BASICALLY, UH, GIVE A NOT RECOMMENDATION, WHAT I WANT TO CALL IT.
UM, A REVIEW OF THE HOST, AND THEN THE HOST GIVES A REVIEW OF THE, OF THE PERSON THAT STAYED THERE AND AS A, IT'S, IT'S, I HAVEN'T HAD ANY PROBLEMS WITH IT.
IN FACT, AND, AND IT WORKS BECAUSE I MEAN, THEY, IT SOMEBODY BASICALLY TRIES TO PUT IN A RESERVATION.
WE GET TO SEE THEIR, UH, BASICALLY THEIR REVIEWS, THEIR REVIEWS.
UM, WE JUST HAD ONE THE OTHER NIGHT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'LL END UP DOING WITH IT.
SERIOUSLY, IT WAS AS SIMPLE AS, AS SIMPLE AS Z NOTED THAT, UH, WHEN THEY STATED X, Y, Z, THEY SLIPPED AND FELL ON THE FLOOR AND SUED 'EM, YOU KNOW, SO YEAH.
UH,
SO ANYWAY, BUT IT'S, IT'S NOT SAYING IT'S PERFECT, BUT IT'S, YEAH.
IF YOU, IF YOU CAUSE HAVOC, IT'S GONNA, YEAH.
THERE IS SOME SELF, AND I'M SURE THERE IS SOME, WHEN YOU BECOME PART OF THE AIRBNB OR VRBO COMMUNITY, THERE IS, LIKE WITH UBER OR SOMETHING ELSE, THERE IS SOME INSURANCE THAT COMES ALONG WITH THAT.
NOW HOW GOOD IT IS, I DON'T KNOW, BUT I'M SURE THERE'S SOME THAT'S INVOLVED WITH THAT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T, YOU CAN'T MESS UP ON EITHER SIDE OF THE EQUATION WITHOUT IT HITTING IT VERY, YOU KNOW, SO YEAH.
NOW THAT YOU'RE THOROUGHLY CONFUSED, I BELIEVE WE HAVE A LITTLE MORE DIRECTION.
SO WE NEED TO SEEK INPUT FROM THE BOARD OR MAYBE SEEK SOME COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
I THINK IT'S GONNA BE, I THINK IT'S GONNA BE GOOD.
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE, WE'VE, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT BEFORE, TRYING TO BE AHEAD OF THINGS, TRYING TO GET ORDINANCES IN PLACE SO WHEN THINGS COME WE'LL BE AHEAD OF THE GAME.
SO THIS IS NOT QUITE PROACTIVE AS IT NEEDS TO BE, BUT AT LEAST IT'S BETTER THAN IT WOULD BE OTHERWISE.
'CAUSE YOU GOT A GOOD FOUNDATION.
UM, WELL NOW Y'ALL GOT ME CONCERNED 'CAUSE I PROBABLY SHOULDN'T MENTION IT.
I HAVE, I, MY AIRBNB'S IN THE COUNTY AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR REGULATIONS ARE, IF THEY HAVE ANY.
SO
[01:40:03]
I'M JUST JOKING.I LIVE IN A COUNTY, BUT WE JUST ROAM FREE A LITTLE BIT, SO, AND ASK QUESTIONS LATER.
BUT, UH, THANK YOU ALL MR. CHAIRMAN.
[6. LAND DEVELOPMENT UPDATE – MARK BASSETT, DINWIDDIE COUNTY PLANNING DIRECTOR]
NUMBER SIX, LAND DEVELOPMENT UPDATES.I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YOU ALL, UH, A BRIEF UPDATE ON DIFFERENT LAND DEVELOPMENT, MAINLY COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT IN THE COUNTY.
IT'S BEEN QUITE A WHILE SINCE WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO GO OVER THAT WITH YOU ALL.
AND JUST MAKE SURE YOU ALL ARE AWARE OF DIFFERENT THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON IN THE COUNTY, MAINLY RELATED TO, UH, COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT, SUBDIVISION DEVELOPMENT.
AND, UH, JUST WANTED TO START OFF, UH, THIS WEEK WE'VE RECEIVED, UH, SITE PLANS FOR THE CHESON ANIMAL HOSPITAL EXPANSION ON FERNDALE ROAD, UH, BOY AND PLANK DINER.
AND YOU ALL TALKED ABOUT SELF STORAGE FACILITY.
UM, WE RECEIVED SITE PLANS FOR THAT GOING IN BESIDE, UH, RON'S MUFFLER ON ROUTE ONE.
UM, THAT PROPERTY THERE, IS IT GONNA BE A CUP THOUGH? 'CAUSE IT'S ON B NO, THAT'S ACTUALLY SPLIT ZONE.
IT'S B TWO UP IN THE FRONT AND ALL M1 IN THE, IN THE BACK.
SO WHERE'S THE DINER? DINER WOULD BE RIGHT UP ON THE FRONT ON ROUTE ONE, RIGHT? OH, OKAY.
IT'D BE ON THE SAME SIDE, THE SAME SITE, PART DINER PART, UM, STILL STORAGE.
I, I MISUNDERSTOOD THAT, BUT YEAH.
YEAH,
IT'S THE PROPERTY BEHIND THE ONE THAT GUY DID
UH, DUNHAM DENTAL DENWITTY, UH, THEY'RE PROPOSING TO BUILD, UH, ABOUT A 8,000 SQUARE FOOT OFFICE BUILDING.
UH, IT'D BE OFF OF AP HILL DRIVE.
THAT'S THE, THERE'S THE CROSS FROM PAMPLIN PARK.
THERE'S THE CAR WASH THERE, AND THEN THERE'S JUST NORTH OF THAT, THERE'S A VACANT LOT.
UM, THAT'S WHERE THAT'S PROPOSED TO GO.
SO WE RECEIVE SITE PLANS FOR THAT AS WELL THIS WEEK.
IS THAT ON THE SAME SIDE OF THE ROAD AS THAT'S THE CAR WASH? IT IS.
THAT'S THE, UM, THE ONE THAT'S RIGHT THERE.
UH, UH, THE HENSHAW FAMILY, MCCRAY'S HOMES AND ELECTRIC ON FOUR 60.
UM, THAT WAS NEVER QUITE COMPLETED.
SO THEY'VE COME BACK AMENDED THEIR SITE PLAN ON THAT AND THEY PLAN TO COMPLETE THAT.
SO, UM, THAT'S UNDER REVIEW AS WELL.
UH, AGRI NUTRIENTS IS EXPANDING.
WILSON'S OPERATION THERE OFF OF HOFHEIMER BETWEEN HOFHEIMER AND THE RAILROAD.
AND HE'S ACTUALLY EVENTUALLY PROPOSING, AS PART OF THE SITE PLAN, HE'S PROPOSING A RAILROAD SPUR, UM, THAT'LL COME OFF OF THAT RAIL LINE THERE INTO HIS PROPERTY.
UM, DON'T KNOW IF YOU ALL ARE AWARE, UH, KPAC TRUCK SHOP, UM, WHERE THE STATE POLICE HEADQUARTERS IS ON SIMPSON ROAD, UH, BEFORE YOU GET TO WAGMAN, UM, BETWEEN 85 AND SIMPSON ROAD, YOU'VE PROBABLY SEEN THAT PROPERTY WAS CLEARED OVER A YEAR AGO.
UH, THE SITE PLAN WAS APPROVED THERE.
EVERYTHING'S BEEN APPROVED, BUT HE STILL, UM, HAS TO GET SOME OF HIS FINAL PERMITS BEFORE HE CAN START, UM, THAT PROJECT.
UM, BUT THAT SITE PLAN HAS BEEN APPROVED.
JUST WANTED TO MAKE YOU AWARE OF THAT.
UH, CENTRAL STATE HOSPITAL, NOT SURE IF YOU ALL ARE AWARE, THAT'S CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION, THE NEW HOSPITAL THERE.
UM, THEY'VE BEEN PUTTING UTILITIES IN OFF OF ROUTE ONE, UM, INTO THE PROPERTY.
UM, SO THAT PROJECT'S MOVING ALONG.
UM, WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH THEM.
OF COURSE, WE DON'T REVIEW THAT SITE PLAN SINCE A A STATE PROJECT.
UM, BUT THE FIRE AND EMS AND, UH, DIM WITTY COUNTY WATER AUTHORITY HAVE BEEN WORKING VERY CLOSELY WITH THEM ON THAT PROJECT.
UM, THE C STORE AT BECK CHAPEL DRIVE AND ROUTE FOUR 60 RIGHT ACROSS FROM AMAZON.
UM, THAT PROJECT, UM, WE'RE VERY CLOSE TO FINAL SITE PLAN REVIEW, I MEAN, APPROVAL ON THAT.
UM, SO HOPEFULLY THAT PROJECT WILL BE FORMALLY ANNOUNCED,
[01:45:01]
HOPEFULLY IN NOVEMBER.WE'RE HOPING END OF OCTOBER, NOVEMBER, POSSIBLY.
UH, OF COURSE YOU'VE ALL SEEN DOLLAR GENERAL ON ROUTE FOUR 60.
UM, THEY'RE ABOUT READY TO GET THEIR FINAL CEO FOR THAT, THAT PROJECT.
UM, DOMINION ENERGY, I'M SURE YOU'VE ALL SEEN THE HIGH VOLTAGE LAB THAT'S BEING CONSTRUCTED ON THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY THERE.
UM, THEY'RE MAKING GOOD PROGRESS ON THAT NOW.
UM, HOPEFULLY LATE FALL, UM, WE'LL BE ABLE TO BE GRANTING THE CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY FOR THAT.
UH, DOMINION ENERGY, THEY'RE ALSO PROPOSING A PROPANE STORAGE, UH, FACILITY OFF OF HOFHEIMER.
UM, THAT'S THE PROPERTY THAT, UH, AGRI NUTRIENTS, IF YOU GO TURN ON HOFHEIMER FROM ROUTE ONE, UM, AGRI NUTRIENTS IS ON THE LEFT.
AND THE NEW, UH, OFFICE COMPLEX IS ALSO ON THE LEFT, THE DRIVEWAY THAT GOES UP TO, UH, AGRI NUTRIENTS, THE VERY NEXT PARCEL, THAT'S WHERE THAT PROPANE STORAGE FACILITY, UH, WOULD BE LOCATED.
SITE PLAN'S BEEN APPROVED THERE, SO HOPEFULLY THAT'LL BE, UH, GOING UNDER CONSTRUCTION AS WELL.
WOULD PROPANE BE BROUGHT IN BY RAIL TOO? NO.
UM, MAYBE IN THE FUTURE, BUT NO, AND THAT'S TO HELP THEM WITH THEIR, I'M NOT QUITE SURE EXACTLY HOW IT WORKS, BUT WITH THEIR OPERATIONS.
SO THEY'VE, THEY'VE, UH, TOLD US ANYWAY, THAT'S VITAL TO THEIR OPERATION, SO THEY, THEY WANT TO GET THAT STARTED AS QUICK AS THEY CAN.
UM, NBC FIBER NODE PROJECT THAT'S GOING ON AIRPORT ROAD, KIND OF THE BACK ENTRANCE TO THE AIRPORT, UM, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE THE, UH, WHAT DO YOU CALL 'EM, THE UTILITY, UH, BUILDINGS FOR ALL THE FIBER, UM, THAT RUNS THROUGH THE COUNTY.
UM, THAT SITE PLAN'S BEEN APPROVED.
HOPEFULLY THAT'LL START CONSTRUCTION.
UH, MCKINNEY, THE SANITARY SEWER SYSTEM IN MCKINNEY IS GONNA BE UPGRADED AND A LOT OF THE LINES REPLACED.
THOSE SITE PLANS HAVE BEEN APPROVED.
UM, THEY GOT A GRANT TO DO THAT PROJECT, SO THAT SHOULD BE STARTING ANY, ANY TIME NOW AS WELL.
UM, WE RELATED TO, UH, RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISIONS APP, APPOMATTOX MANOR, UH, SECTION THREE, THAT'S KENNETH DRIVE OFF OF RIVER ROAD.
UM, THAT 19 LOTS SITE PLANS HAVE BEEN APPROVED FOR THAT.
THAT'S KIND OF BEEN SITTING FOR A YEAR OR SO.
UH, WAITING TO BE, WHERE IS IT THAT DEVELOPED? UH, KENNETH DRIVE, IF YOU ARE HEADING, I GUESS IT'D BE WEST OUT RIVER ROAD.
IT'S BEFORE YOU GET TO OAK KNOLL, IT SUBDIVISION RIGHT ACROSS FROM WEST AL.
UM, CEDAR RIDGE SECTION TWO, THAT'S OFF OF BLUE TARTAN.
UM, THOSE PLANS HAVE BEEN APPROVED.
THE FINAL PLATT'S BEEN APPROVED, SO I BELIEVE THEY'RE STARTING TO SELL LOTS IN THAT, THAT SECTION OF THE SUBDIVISION.
DOES THAT TRIGGER THE NUMBER? NO, NO.
THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA BE ONE SHY.
THINK THEY, THEY'RE ONE OR TWO SHY.
UH, DANCY ESTATE SUBDIVISION, I'M SURE WE'RE ALL AWARE OF THAT.
RYAN HOLMES HAS BEEN BUILDING HOMES IN THERE THAT'S, UH, OFF OF SIMMONS AVENUE, BEHIND MCDONALD'S THERE ON ROUTE ONE.
UM, ACTUALLY I THINK BRAD'S APPROVED BUILDING PERMITS FOR I THINK ALL THE LOTS IN THERE, UM, IN, IN THAT SUBDIVISION.
UH, FORT EMERY ESTATES SECTION TWO THAT'S OFF OF FORT EMERY ROAD AND SQUIRREL LEVEL ROAD.
UM, THEY'RE LOOKING AT DOING SOME MORE LOTS THERE.
UM, POPLAR GROVE ESTATES THAT'S OFF OF V ROAD AND SQUIRREL LEVEL ROAD AREA.
IT'S ACTUALLY OFF OF BETHUNE DRIVE.
UM, THEY'RE PROPOSING 20 LOTS THERE.
UM, WE'RE PROBABLY GETTING CLOSE TO, UH, SITE PLAN APPROVAL FOR THAT.
AND WHEN WE DO THAT, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO BRING PRELIMINARY PLAT TO SHOW YOU ALL FOR PUBLIC REVIEW OF THAT, THAT SUBDIVISION.
UM, I'M TRYING TO THINK OF ANY TURKEY RUN SUBDIVISION THAT'S OFF OF TURKEY EGG ROAD.
UM, THAT'S THE ROCK RIVER HOMES.
UM, THEY'RE WORKING ON GETTING THEIR ROADS INTO THE VO SYSTEM.
SO THEY'RE DOING THEIR FINAL, UH, TOUCHUPS ON THAT SUBDIVISION TO GET THAT TAKEN INTO
[01:50:01]
THE VO SYSTEM FOR, FOR ROAD MAINTENANCE.DO Y'ALL, ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT ANY OF THE PROJECTS OR ANYTHING YOU'VE SEEN GOING ON THAT WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO LET YOU KNOW ABOUT MR. MR. BASS DAY, UH, NASH ROAD PROJECT RIGHT DOWN THERE? RIGHT.
DID THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, THEY UH, THEY DID HELP HOLD PUBLIC HEARING AT THAT, AT THEIR SEPTEMBER MEETING AND THEY TABLED IT.
AND ASKED THE DEVELOPER TO CONSIDER, UM, OFFERING SOME OTHER PROFFERS RELATED TO THAT.
SO THAT, THAT'S COMING UP FOR, UH, PUBLIC HEARING AGAIN NEXT WEEK, NEXT TUESDAY NIGHT.
DO YOU REMEMBER WHAT THEY WERE, DO YOU REMEMBER WHAT THEY WERE? BASICALLY THE BOARD INDICATED THAT THEY WANTED TO HAVE A QUALITY SUBDIVISION IN THERE AND ANYTHING THEY COULD DO TO ENHANCE THE PROFFERS TO MAKE THAT A QUALITY SUBDIVISION, THAT'S WHAT THEY WANT TO SEE.
SO BRAD'S WAITING ON REVISED PROFFERS AS WE SPEAK, I BELIEVE
WHERE AGAIN, THE, UM, SQUARE FOOTAGE, MINIMUM SQUARE FOOTAGE, STREET LIGHTING, UM, WALKING MINIMUM SQUARE FOOT FOOTAGE.
WHAT WAS THAT? UM, DO YOU REMEMBER? I, I DON'T KNOW.
THEY ASKED THE DEVELOPER TO CONSIDER, UM, INCREASING THE MINIMUM SQUARE FOOTAGE, UM, IN THE SUBDIVISION OVER THE TOTAL NUMBER OR JUST A PERCENTAGE.
UH, THEY HAD TALKED ABOUT A, A TOTAL NUMBER AND THEY ALSO TALKED ABOUT A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE AS WELL.
SO, WE'LL, WE'LL SEE WHAT THEY COME BACK WITH.
I DON'T, SINCE MR. TUCKER BROUGHT UP THE, UH, THAT'S THE SAME STUFF THAT WE ASKED HIM TO DO.
WELL, SINCE YOU BROUGHT UP THE, THE TURN LANE THING, AND I, I TRIED TO SPEAK TO THE APPLICANT VERY SPECIFICALLY ABOUT WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE.
WHERE DOES THAT STAND AS A PROPERTY RIGHT NOW? I, THEY DID MAKE SOME CHANGES TO THAT.
AND, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF THE BOARD'S, UM, YOU KNOW, THOROUGHLY PLEASED WITH THE CHANGES THEY MADE, BUT THEY DID MAKE SOME MINOR TWEETS TO THAT TO TRY TO ADDRESS THAT, THAT ISSUE.
UM, BUT THEY ASKED THEM TO LOOK AT, UM, ADDITIONAL AMENITIES, THAT TYPE OF THING RELATED TO THE SUBDIVISION AS WELL.
HE ASKED FOR, SO I I, WERE THEY SPECIFIC IN ANY WAY THE EITHER ONE OF 'EM, THE BOARD OR THE APPLICANT? YEAH, THE APPLICANT DID, UM, REVISE THE PROFFERS BEFORE THE, THE FIRST PUBLIC HEARING.
THEY SAID THEY WOULD'VE PUT A GAZEBO IN, UH, IT WOULD BE A TWO ACRE LOT, I BELIEVE WITH, UH, A WALKING TRAIL.
THEY WOULD DEDICATE ONE OF THE LOTS, WHICH WOULD BE TWO ACRES.
AND, AND OH, AND THEY, THEY ADDED SOMETHING ABOUT, UM, THEY WOULD HAVE, IT WASN'T REAL SPECIFIC, SO I CAN'T SPEAK TO WHAT IT EXACTLY WOULD BE, BUT THEY DID SAY SOMETHING ABOUT PLAYGROUND EQUIPMENT.
SO THIS STILL SHOWING LOTS IN THE FLOODPLAIN? YES.
WHICH I WILL SAY, UM, JUST IN GENERAL, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN HAVE PORTIONS OF LOTS IN FLOODPLAIN, SO THAT'S, THAT'S NOT UNUSUAL TO HAVE THAT, SO I UNDERSTAND.
BUT THOSE, UNLESS HE CHANGED THEM FROM ONE I SAW HE HAD COMPLETE LOTS SHOWN IN THE FLOOD PLAIN.
WELL, YEAH, THAT LONG 20 CREEK.
THAT COULD BE A PUT ALL STILL, THAT COULD BE AN ISSUE.
BUT THOSE ARE THE TYPES OF THINGS THAT THE, THAT THE BOARD DISCUSSED AT, AT THE MEETING.
AND IT SOUND LIKE THEY SAID IN OUR MEETING, THEY WERE, THEY WERE WELL AWARE OF THE ISSUES THAT YOU ALL BROUGHT UP.
THAT, THAT'S ALL I HAVE, MR. CHAIR.
20, 35 OR 40 ON MY ROUNDABOUT.
YOU TOLD ME THE RED LIGHT WAS DEAD.
2026 IS 25 OR 26 WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING AT FOR INSTRUCTION.
[01:55:05]
OKAY.